Transcription Episode #116

Guys, thank you so much for joining us on threads podcast real quick. Our interview tonight is with Don Taylor off, you are gonna love this interview, she was amazing, a fighter a badass, and salty as you’ll find out in the interview. If you want to reach out to Don, if you go to the Taylor that’s the Taylor you can look at all the awesome things that she does, and you’re gonna you’re gonna really love this interview. But before we get into that, just a quick couple of housekeeping things. Obviously threads podcast comm for everything threads related, you can also go there and click support us which will take you to a site called buy me a coffee. So what’s that you can buy Ben and I a coffee one time two times, three times 100 coffees, whatever you want, just to support us as we’re moving forward in this podcast journey. And also you can sign up for a membership which gets you exclusive access to a private group with us and a bunch of other perks. So go to buy me a slash threads. Forget that just go to buy me a coffee and search for threads, podcast life unfiltered. Also, if you’re interested in a newsletter, if you go to threads you can definitely find a spot that says newsletter click there and sign up. Also rate review, I once had a friend reached out like how can we help you grow your show and like rating and reviewing the show would really help as well. Mostly on Apple podcasts. So if you’re not an apple junkie, that’s okay, we still love you. But yeah, that’s what moves the needle. You can still give us a review on Apple podcasts even if you don’t have an iPhone. But anyways, enjoy the interview with Don Taylor. Thanks, guys. Have a great one.

Hi, guys, welcome to threads podcast life unfiltered. Thank you so much for joining us tonight. Tomorrow, whenever you’re listening to this. I’m really excited to be recording tonight. And our guests Don Taylor, we’re talking about her and a little bit. But before we get into that Ben’s gonna introduce what threads is all about and what tonight’s bucket we’re touching on.

All right, well, thank you for joining us for Episode 116. I can’t believe I say it every time. But man, that number just keeps climbing. And this has just been an exciting run. So if you’re new to threads, perhaps you’re listening because of our guest tonight. Just wanted to give you a little bit of a rundown on what this is all about. threads podcast is a chance for Jason and I as hosts to have conversations about the deeper things of life, about things that matter about things that are sometimes uncomfortable to talk about. We want to create a space where it’s okay to talk about those things, and where we can be vulnerable. And we really feel and believe strongly that when we are most vulnerable, we are the most strong. So by doing this show, our goal is to help you our listener, have the courage to have similar conversations in your life. We really believe that what we do here matters. And we want to give you as listeners a chance to go and do likewise, we have three buckets that we focus on each week. The first is mental health. And we’ll be spending a lot of time there tonight. The other two buckets are faith and uncomfortable conversations. And I’m sure we’ll have traces of those as well. But we’re camping out primarily in the mental health bucket on today’s episode.

How was that at

the end? That was a great and that that pocket today. Jason?

So dawn, Ben wrote, like under themes, but I feel like this is how we describe you vulnerable, authentic badass, like, That was perfect. And thank you for joining us. And I’m just again, I read your bio a little bit and I think we’re gonna hit it off tonight. So why don’t you introduce yourself a little bit just like maybe a 62nd elevator speech and then we’ll do a little couple icebreaker things and kind of dive right in.

For sure. So my name is Don Taylor and I am a trauma specialist. And I really my forte is people that have been really, really hurt. So I work with kids as young as 12 seniors into their 80s. And it’s really strategy based for people that are sick of the How does that make you feel therapy weekly conversations and need to like dig in deep and actually change their lives. And so I work with anyone from people that have been raised in cults to people that have dealt with Rape, Abuse, abandonment, severe depression, anxiety. infertility divorce, a little bit of everything. I just passionately love people. And like you said, I have a pretty crazy bio. And I’ve come from a pretty crazy background. And I realized that there I needed someone to just like, tell me what to do. I was like, I need someone to just like, guide me. And so I have a very strategy based way of working with people and totally customized.

That’s amazing. Perfect. So it’s Friday night, we’ve all had eventful weeks, share four or five words that sum up how we’re showing up tonight, which I really liked that like what what is everyone feeling like we we all put showmanship on because it’s a podcast, but we try. I mean, even us being vulnerable. Sometimes it’s just a shitty night. And it’s just like, so I’m gonna let Ben go first and then I can jump in or Don you can jump into

Well, if I had to pick four. We’ll go with four words. How I’m showing up tonight. I would say rested. was anxious. Now calm. I guess that’s five. So those are my words.

It’s okay. We won’t hold you to the four to five word right. It’s totally okay. Why don’t you go ahead, Don.

Oh, my forwards for showing up tonight. Excited. I’m passionate. salty. Awesome. And excited.

Mine are scared after that salty comment. No. No, I’m feeling I’m feeling rested as well. That’s a good one. A little anxious. for the interview. I don’t know why. I think a little bit Oh man. I’m going I’m it’s four or five words. I can’t do four or five words. I’m like digressing. Like why I’m

on 17 a month.

It’s all right.

Oh my gosh. So I’ll just say rested. anxious.



How’s that? That’s three.

That’s good. Full. Is that good? All right, we want to dive into anybody’s words. anybody’s words? Yeah. Tell me All right. Any more? Yeah, what’s up with salty.

Um, it’s just been, it’s been a really super, really beautifully intense week. That’s the only way to sum it up. And we my husband and I moved just about three and a half months ago, from a city of almost a million to a town of 5000. And I arrive on the energy the city and we moved to open a healing home for people to come to and do immersion style healing work. So it’s perfect for that. But I crave city and this weekend, we were supposed to be spending a day in a city so I could like get my energy fix. And now we’re supposed to have like some polar vortex thing and be snowed in. And it just made me really grumpy. No, I need the city and my husband actually was like, a little salty today. Ah.

So So what was the reason for the move? That if I missed it, I’m sorry. I was,

um, we’re putting actually I’m about one month out from opening a healing home. Okay, but like we have for your emotions.

Okay, so did you move to a smaller town just be more affordable to for the property or just what called you to the smaller town?

Less affordable, actually. Oh, wow. But yeah. That was fun in the middle of COVID? No, we moved to because I’ve had a long term dream of opening a healing home where people could come to and stay on, like a luxury suite on a beautiful property surrounded by nature, where they could come to and do immersion style work on their mental health, or their business or their personal life. And or couples could come. And I decided why not in the middle of COVID, why not? And so to go to get the kind of property I wanted, and the kind of house we needed, with the weather we needed and meant that we had to move quite far away from where we were so.

Wow, very cool. Well, do you have any questions for us wanted to dig in any of the words we shared?

A lot of you are anxious, what’s going on?

It’s anxiety filled podcasts in general, we both deal with anxiety.

Yeah. So from my side of the fence, I made a big, bold move this week, Wednesday, and I’ll just go ahead and say it but because by the time this airs, it’ll be old news. Anyway, I quit my job on Wednesday, I walked I said I’m done. This is not good for my mental health. I’m done. So, and I did that with a very solid job opportunity that was on my horizon but I had not accepted or received an offer. So it’s been a little bit of an anxious couple of days here just waiting for things to get finalized. And I took this you step of faith. And so I’ve been fighting that sense of, Oh shit, I just quit my job. What if this doesn’t pan out?

Oh, but what if it does?

Exactly. And that’s what I’ve been kicking myself, really trying to get myself to see things from that perspective. And, you know, I’ve just had a moment of why is it so easy for me to be pessimistic? And to think the worst? And, and yet, why is it so hard to look for the good in the situation? So I’ve actually I’m rested, because I took, I decided, after quitting my job, I decided that I was going to go on a personal retreat. And I booked a hotel room for two nights, and I’ve just been taking care of me. So

congratulations. Thank you. So a little, if you don’t mind, can I coach you for two seconds on that? Please go for it. So our body’s physical chemical response is identical from excitement to anxiety is the meaning that we attach to it. So when you see probably, if you’re a very anxious person, I could probably ask When’s the last time you were really excited? And you’re like, never, I don’t remember the last time. That’s why is because we attach that meaning to it. And so when the anxiety is starting, ask yourself like, what about this could be amazing. Yeah, what about this could be exciting. And if you could just like continually ask yourself that over and over and over, your brain will actually start to trigger how you’re thinking about things.

That’s really good thought. I like that.

Face the worst case scenario, face it head on, don’t be scared of it, because it’s only gigantic because you’re not looking at it, right? It’s like the shadow behind you. And when you can turn around and just throw a face on and be like, okay, worst case scenario, what’s it gonna be? Right? And then you can have a backup plan for that, well, then you can actually face what’s coming and be like, bring it

up. Yep.

Right, because you already know how to deal with the worst that could happen.

Exactly. And then another thing that I realized that I did, which is huge. Are you familiar with the sunk cost fallacy or sunk cost bias?

No, when it’s me,

all right, well, I think it’s a mix of like a financial term, and a mental health or psychology. But basically, the sunk cost fallacy is when you look at a situation and you look at the cost and everything it took for you to get invested in that job in that investment, even financially, whatever it is, you put a lot of time you put a lot of energy, you put a lot of emotion into it. So by golly, I’m just gonna see it through. Because I put a lot into this. And there’s a lot. And so instead of looking at this situation, and saying, I took a huge leap of faith to take this job, so I just need to buck it up and make it happen. Because there’s so much that I’ve invested in it. The sunk cost fallacy is basically, you just stay put out of fear of losing the things that you’ve invested in it. And it’s almost like insanity, thinking that it’s going to turn out different by doing the same thing. And that doesn’t ever work. So

I feel like it’s deeper than that, though.

What’s that?

Well, like, there’s the money you put into it. Oh, we live in a world where we’re so willing to waste money on anything and everything. How many people have like a gym membership that they’ve paid for for five years? Because they’re too lazy to go in and do the paperwork to cancel it? Right. Right. Like, like, we are the most wasteful society ever. But like, deep down, I see this all the time with my clients is it’s more of a fear of like being a failure, or not being worthy of having more sure or not believing that they deserve more, right? And you can step out of that and be like, what, like way, the way the benefits outweigh the cost? Right? For sure. being miserable or leaving and potentially, what right, yeah,

I think a lot of people have that with their job, though. I think we all come to that at some point. You know, if it’s not something that you super love, but you’re like, I got these bills to pay and comfortable. I’m not 100% happy but like, so yeah, I totally get that. I’ve never heard it explained that way before.

Yeah, it was new to me when I heard it. And it was actually. So in the past, I worked with a life coach. And you know, anytime I have a job change or something that’s a little bit jarring. He’s totally fine with me texting him, even though I’m not officially a client anymore. And that was one of the things that he shared with me. He was like, Well, you’ve managed to get through this without that. sunk cost bias and I had a Google It was like, Wait, what?

You’re like, I don’t understand the verbiage.

Yeah. So, but no, it was a really powerful concept for me. So

yeah, that is really powerful. I like it.

I’ve got a quote here. This is something that a friend of the threads podcast actually put on Facebook. I believe it was brandy. She’s been a guest a number of times. She shared this on her personal Facebook page, it says, quick note, your brutal honesty. Ain’t nobody asked him for that. Where’s your clever honesty, your compassionate honesty, your insightful honesty, uplifting, poetic and powering. Take your brutal honesty and go sit in the back with all the devil’s advocates.

What do you think about that?

I love it. I absolutely love it. I think there’s so much truth to that. I think there’s a time and a place to be brutally honest. But I don’t think it has to be all the time. You know, I feel like why do we need to be brutal? In our honesty, can’t we? You know, be clever, compassionate, insightful, like all those words. You know, sometimes brutal is needed. But other times, it’s really not. And I think it does more damage than it does good. In the spirit of how it’s given.

How about you, Don?

Thank you so much of the intention behind it. Right. It’s so much the intention behind it, and how you’re giving it but also if it’s being asked for?

Oh, man, I struggle with unsolicited advice.

No, unsolicited, no. But like, that’s one of the things that often clients will tell me is they’re like, you often say what we need to hear, not what we want to hear. But it’s sometimes it might feel brutal, depending on our definition that sometimes it might feel really strong. But it’s said with so much love, it said with so much like the intention behind it is so pure, that I’m willing to take it. Yeah, I feel like it’s almost a pendulum swing, right? Like, we have the people that are just like, I’m going to annihilate you and be brutal, because it’s coming from a place of judgment. Or I’m gonna be like, no, that’s a great idea. But don’t you feel I should do all the bad things and like, there has to be a happy medium there.

Don’t you feel like you have to have a pretty good relationship with somebody to like, you know, if I meet somebody on the street, and we talked for like, 15 minutes, and I do the brutal honesty, even though it may be coming from a good place for me, they might perceive it as being an A Oh,

yeah. It’s it’s no your room.

Yeah. I

just wonder because you say we’re clients, and I think they you all have a relationship, they get the way you do that?

Oh, totally. No, you’re gonna you’re gonna like you read your room. See, that’s my problem. No, your people know your people. And if you’re like, if you’re in a position where you’re, like, allowed, right where they’re going to receive it. My husband always says opinions are like assholes. Just because you have one doesn’t mean you have to share it with everybody. And I feel like that kind of ties into this

that can be applied to a lot of things that come from miles. No kidding. Yeah.

Oh, man. Well, we’re gonna shift gears and jump into the interview discussion portion of our episode. But as we do that, I’m just gonna put it out there. For our listeners, this might feel a little bit different. As you may recall from previous interviews, we have a lot of listeners that might recall the guests answering all kinds of questions that cover the broad range like parenting, we talk about finances, we’ve talked about all these different facets of life. And I feel like with our previous guests, we had some really good interviews, but I don’t think we quite reached the depth that we have the potential to so Don, you are our guinea pig tonight for doing things maybe a little bit differently. Instead of going wide. In our interview, we’re we’re trying to stay narrow and deep to go beyond, you know, the mile wide and an inch deep. So that’s kind of where we’re headed. So instead of a broad range, we’re just kind of do this. If you think of like a swimming pool, we’ll start in the shallow end. And then we’ll work our way a little bit deeper kind of building off of each question. That is where we will head you’ve already given us your elevator speech. So just a question kind of following up on that. As a child, What did you dream of being when you grew up?

Oh, so many things. Um, ultimately, I wanted to be a stay at home mom with four kids.

Really? Hmm.

I really did. I went through my phases of wanting to be a marine biologist. Till I realized that the smell of fish made me throw up. So that wasn’t gonna last very long. I thought about being a teacher. But as much as I loved teaching people I was like, I don’t want people to don’t learn. So that’s not my forte. And really, that’s what it came down to. I married my high school sweetheart, and that was always our ultimate dream. That was our goal was like, I wanted to be a stay at home mom, raise the kids.

That’s a big job though. Like, right? Yeah,

I feel as a woman with like, a big career and no children, right? I

mean, I just know that like, during quarantine, when I’ve had my kids home. My youngest son is autistic, and he’s high functioning. But man, I realized how I can’t be a stay at home dad or a teacher. Like I can give him love. And I can do those things. But oh, man, being a stay at home parent, Mom, dad doesn’t matter. It’s, it’s, it can be

a huge it’s such a huge shock.

Yeah, and you don’t realize and Ben and I talk about this a lot is like you’re creating these little people like, the way you interact with them and the what you do with them. It molds them it doesn’t really matter their genetics. It’s it’s nurture. Like if you


my friend always says you’re you’re literally your entire job is to raise good adults.

Yeah, very true.

Yeah, it is.

She’s like that is my job. is my job to raise these three amazing adults. That’s it.

Yeah, that’s what I call parenting with the end in mind.

Yeah. Oh, it’s a tough job. But I’m sure we’ll get into that. So we’re gonna jump right into the diving board section. I’m going to read this quote and then ask a question, the passage the place we develop our deepest convictions about ourselves, life and God, one cannot enter another’s past merely by hearing the conclusions and convictions that resulted from it. But by being invited into the story itself, when one is permitted into this terrain, the guest stands on holy ground. So I don’t know what any of that means. Ben wrote it, or Ben put it in there.

He’s got a great job of faking it while you read it horse.

I’m a professional. This is Episode 116, bro, like,

he sounded pretty convinced about what you were reading and my vulnerabilities really

big on. Like my vulnerability. I’m

like, I don’t know what the hell that means.

But I hope Don does.

In five minutes, give me a give or take Tell us about your life experience that ultimately led you to becoming a coach. We know what you’re doing now. But this kind of you can you can take 30 minutes, I don’t care. But just how you got to where you are, because that’s the most important. Not the most important part of your story right now is but you are you are because of what happened?

Oh 100%. So, first time I looked around was like, I am not like everybody else. I was eight or nine. And I was born to a mom who loved me in the best way that she could but she tried to miscarry me her whole pregnancy she had postpartum depression. It was bad. And so I grew up with the inability to bond and a lot of struggles around that which I work with a lot of clients with now. And then it went on to having a really rough childhood. So starting with that easy, easy entrance into the world, right, right. But by 12 I broke my back and had to do a lot of rehabilitation on that at 14 I was sexually abused by an uncle 15 I had a severe eating disorder down to 87 pounds at 69 attempted suicide actually died in the found me and revived me at 17 I had a brain aneurysm and lost my entire identity and just about died. And then life got hard. And I was just in high school. Right and then life got hard and I went on to deal with infertility and drug addiction because of it and death of a parent abandonment of a parent. Just one thing after the other after the other and I remember sitting at my kitchen table I was 28 and it always like everything had just piled on so hard so fast. And I was scrappy. I’m still like I said, like I was feeling salty today. I’m feeling better now. But you know, I was always a little scrappy and was so tired of fighting. I was so tired of fighting and talking to therapists after therapists after pastor after social worker after psychiatrist or psychologist after doctor and no one could seem to get the answers on how to heal everything that I’ve gone through and I always describe it as you know, by the time I was at a point where the shock had worn off after one and I could start dealing with it something else happened. Right so everything just piled and piled and piled yet on the outside. It looks like a cave from this beautiful family with like, parents are still together in the Pretty Little House on the pretty little street with you know going to church every Sunday. Getting straight A’s and older sister younger brother, like, everything looks so good and I’m dying inside. And I sat on my kitchen table and was like, I can’t, I can’t actually do this anymore. I can’t like I refuse to live in my head for the rest of my life. And at that point financially, we couldn’t afford for me to continue to work on my mental health the way that I was. And I told my husband, long, long story really short, I told my husband, I was giving myself a year to try to figure it out. And I wrote out all of my trauma on recipe cards, and I shuffled them and I picked up the first one I was like, Alright, how do you fix this? How do you deal with this? And started looking at how do you rewire someone’s brain? How do you neurologically deal with something like that? How do you not surface heal? How do you not just have to go on antidepressants which numbs everything? How do you like, I want emotions? I want emotions, right? I just don’t want to constantly be didn’t want to be dead. So how do you?

How do you balance that?

Right? How do you balance that right, but in a healthy way, and this isn’t? My families that are listening to this are going to be like, oh, and that’s okay, because they’ve also read my book and had that reaction. Yeah. But I also hit a point where I was looking at my family and going, I will do everything in my power to not be you guys.

I know that feeling.

Right? Like, like, you guys might actually be really great people, but I will not spend my life being you. And so how to almost like break out of that box as well. When even like the culture I was raised in, in the church I was raised in and the life I was raised in was so structured into who I should be and how I should be and what that was going to look like. And so I spent a year figuring it out, I went to conference after conference, I read books, I did research into neurology and brains and how things work and started to heal. I started to heal my own life. And I would interview people, I remember going to like, counsel after counsel after counselor being like, nope, they’re not working. How am I going to fix this? Like, how am I going to figure this out? And people on the outside started watching and asking me questions. So I’d be over coffee with somebody and they’d be like, were my husband are really struggling. We just found out we can have kids? How are you guys dealing with that? And I’d be like, oh, grab a pen and paper. I’m going to teach you the strategy I came up with on how to actually like, work through that when she like, they’d look at me funny and go a strategy. And I was like, Yeah, okay, start with having this conversation. And then I want you to do this, then I want you to do this, and then do this. And then do this. When you hit this point, call me again, we’re gonna do another coffee. And people just started asking for advice. And I was talking to my childhood bestie one day, and she’s like, you didn’t realize you spend the majority of your time helping people? Like, why are you not doing this for a career? And I was like me talking about, right. She’s like, you have more certifications and more hours of training than anyone I’ve ever met. Because you were using it on you. She’s like, we got some pretty cool strategies. She’s like, why don’t you like, share them with people. And so that’s where it started. And I think because of my personality and who I am and how I deal with people, I this is how funny I really attract male clients, and people with really intense personalities. Because I’m really safe. And I don’t beat around the bush and I’m like, Okay, let’s do this. Let’s not just sit and talk about feelings. Let’s actually dig in and let’s do the work. And so then it’s just become referral based since then. Okay. Yeah, there’s a lot. You actually got it.


I’ve had a really insane life. Yeah, that’s really where it started. Because I get it right. I’ve been where they are. And so people can come to me and be like, this is what’s going on. And I’m like, Yeah, okay, I know exactly where you’re at. Now, let’s heal. Yeah, I

got a couple like, I feel like the structured pneus of your story falls into Ben’s life growing up, and then I feel like the go to church on Sunday, everything’s fine on the outside. But a physical abuse was going on at home falls into my bucket, or my side. And that’s, it’s interesting. One of the things that came to mind too, when you were talking is and this is off the cuff we we put a rundown on but you know, I think the questions better happen when you know, during discussion, but what do you feel like people think when, you know, because the traditional route is therapy. I’m going to therapy, Ben’s going to therapy where we peer pressure people to go to therapy, like that’s what we do, because it’s been so impactful for our lives. Yeah. So you took a not a traditional route and I wonder if

Ha, I took a combo. I took a combo. Yeah, years of therapy.

But it didn’t sound like it was beneficial for you.

not overly No.

Yeah. So that’s typically I don’t know, I feel like if someone’s going to therapy a lot, a lot, it something’s got to hit at some point. So I often wonder if you get any feedback from people when you say yeah, like, therapies, and but I got these strategies to help.

Oh, people react very strongly to that. Yes, yeah. And you know what part of it is, therapy works really well, for a lot of people. It works phenomenally for a lot of people. And if that’s your like, if that’s what works for you, that’s phenomenal. Right? And that’s where there’s a lot of people, myself included, where when I sit in a therapists office, and I start talking about everything that I was dealing with, and their jaw drops, right, one of the things is when you’ve dealt with enough trauma in your life, that you’re terrified to even tell your story, because it might cause someone else harm, or cause them to be triggered. Or you look at them and go, Oh, you have no idea where to start. Like you have no idea how to unpack everything I just told you. Right? Yeah. And then it becomes this belief that yet again, in your life, you’re too much yet again, in your life, you’re too broken. Right? Or you are in a situation like I was like, I need really fast results. Right? I need really fast results. I can’t sit here for 15 minutes a week for the rest of my life. Because a I can’t afford it. But be there’s not that much time. Yeah, I can’t be alive that long.

So you’re you’re wanting you’re wanting to fast track it, which is cache lines, right with me, too. I hate waiting.

totally right. But that was like where my brain was. And so that was really like when in healing my life in such crazy ways. And you know, with help of other people and conferences and things, right, but in doing that, that’s when like, clients have come to me and be like, okay, I don’t have that much time. Like, I got a month and I’m out. How fast can we heal my life. And I remember sitting in a therapists office on time and being like, can’t we just do like an hour and a half. And she was like, What? And I broke it down for her. I was like, Look, it takes me 20 to 25 minutes to be able to get to the point and get vulnerable, then I actually start to feel things and I’m just at the point where I’m ready to dig deep. And then it’s like 45 minutes, and we’re up at 50. And now you have to pay and like, Let’s reschedule and I’ll see you in two weeks. And then I drive away being like, wait, I’m sitting in the depths of my hell right now. I don’t know how to deal with this. And I can’t just like close this up and put it in my journal and walk away from it for two weeks and come back. Because that doesn’t work for my brain. That’s not how I work. Right. Right. And so it was it’s it’s people, people that show up at my office are typically people that are like, yeah, I tried that. And it didn’t work. Perfect. I tried that. And I felt too broken. My story was too much. I can’t, I just can’t anymore. I need something. I need something different. Right? I’m a huge advocate of getting help. Oh my gosh, yes. Right. And then if that’s going to church, go to church, talk to your pastor, if that’s seeing a therapist, see a therapist, if that’s doing Reiki therapy, reiki, healing, do Reiki healing, like, do whatever it is that you need to do to deal with your mental health. Yeah, right. But it’s that point where you’re like, I’m too broken, and I just can’t. That’s where it’s like, No, no,

there’s more. There’s more options. Awesome. So before, I’m gonna read a quote from your website that I really liked, but you bring up a good point about therapy. It’s such a business transaction at the end, how great would it be? Like my therapist, for whatever reason, can’t do it on AutoPay? Like she she doesn’t have the credentials yet. She just started her own practice. I mean, she’d been with someone for a long time. How great would it be you would just be like, Alright, man, have a good one. And like you just walk out, you don’t reschedule? You don’t pay at the time because it almost is like it shuts all the emotions off. And you’re like, Okay, it’s time for business, which I get it, it is a business, I totally get it. What a great idea to just be like, we’ll talk tomorrow, we’ll reschedule and you know, the cards already on file and just to set it up like that before you have sessions.

I do that with a lot of my clients because they need that. But I also offer where people can call me or text me or email me anytime they’re like, hard triggered. Yeah. Right, where it’s like, I’m in a situation right now. And I’m melting hard and I need help. Yeah, my clients know that they can call me email me text me and I’ll be like, Hey, what’s going on? Let’s walk you through it right now. So we’re in the moment. Okay. Awesome. Yeah, I worked very different and very unconventional. So

the quote that I found on the website is it just says, actually, I don’t even know if it’s I just copied and pasted. I’m not really a quote says, I just wanted someone to tell me what to do just to give me the step by step. process of how to heal and yet no one did. So what did I do? I created my own path, a personalized process of what I needed to do to face each unique challenge. And that’s where I think you and I can connect, because that’s what I want. Like I tell my therapist a lot. I actually canceled my session for tomorrow because I didn’t have anything to talk about, which is good and bad. I don’t know, that’s for another day. But I just tell her, I’m like, Can you give me these three steps that I can have something tangible to work on? And it sounds like that’s what you do?

Well, they’re often not allowed. Yes, right. It’s something that’s really big in Canada right now is a lot of psychologists are becoming life coaches. Hmm. So that they can help people in a different way, and they’re not so bound by the regulations. Right. But I remember a psychologist telling me I begged her I sat in her office crying, and begging her to just tell me what to do. And she was like, What do you mean, and I had waited years to get in with her. She was one of the best, right? I thought maybe if she’s like, good enough, she’ll finally be able to heal me. And I said, Tell me what to do. And she said, What do you mean, I was like, I don’t care if I have to, like, get up at five o’clock tomorrow morning, read this books down like a flamingo, jump up and down, eat for grapefruits. And then listen to the CD all day while I’m working like, I don’t care, I just need to know that you have a plan, I need to know that there’s a system, I need to know that there’s like, okay, we’re going to start here, then we’re going to go here, then we’re going to go there. This is what I want you to do. I was like, I need you to tell me that. And she, she actually sat down with to me. And she’s like, I can’t. I was like, What do you mean, she’s like, I’m not allowed?

That’s weird. Interesting.

Is that, is that like a universal health care thing?

From what I understand? So I do I coach, some psychologists, like they’re my clients. And they all they all have agreed with that, because they said it’s all about it’s talk therapy. So it’s all about asking specific questions to elicit specific results. And so the person talks themselves through to their own conclusion. And I might get in trouble for this. But I think part of the problem with that is that we are in a time of life where we’re not creating critical thinkers anymore.


100%. So when we’re doing therapy in a style that’s meant for critical thinkers that are actually going to follow those thought processes. And they’re going to think it through and they’re going to ask the questions, and they’re going to dig in, and they’re going to get curious that that’s not who we have anymore.

That’s a really good point.

We have people that get angry if it takes more than two minutes in a McDonald’s drive thru to get their food, because they’re impatient with people that lose their minds on an airplane because they don’t have proper Wi Fi with people. They’re like, I need faster because I can’t download a movie in two seconds. Right? Like, we aren’t critical thinkers anymore, because we have Google.

Yes. That is really good. Yeah.

So that when it comes to therapy, I believe personally, that that’s the reason why it doesn’t work forever, it doesn’t work for everyone anymore, is because it’s designed around critical thinking, hmm.

What are some obstacles other than just

going to get in trouble, by the way for saying all this, I’m sure.

Why are you gonna get in trouble from

probably my own team?

Are they all young? Yeah. You didn’t say the M word. So that’s fine. Right.

Go ahead, Ben. So with that critical thinking component that we just touched on, you mentioned the fact that we can basically find anything on Google, which is true and frightening to some degree. But I’m just curious, from your perspective, is there anything else that you feel prevents somebody from being a critical thinker? So, for example, is it possible to be a critical thinker when you are just riddled with anxiety? That sort of thing? I’m just curious from your vantage point. Are there any other obstacles to that critical thinking piece that is missing from so many?

Absolutely. I think that we don’t know how to be curious anymore. We don’t know how to be curious. We look at everything with judgment instead of curiosity. Every behavior is put in a box, every action is put in a box, everything must have great meaning behind it. And so then we get we get caught in these moments. And because the majority of people have had trauma, and by trauma, I mean any event of emotion or environment that’s caused a massive shift in your direction, right? You are going down this path that all of a sudden this happened. It doesn’t have to be you were held at gunpoint or you were beaten or any of the big ones, right, like trauma can be something that’s really Tiny in the eyes of society, but a huge impact of you. So now we live life having these trauma responses to everything. We’re also when someone says something and we react in a out of a trauma response ways we have this like big, huge response. And instead of sitting back and going, wait, if I wasn’t actually judging that, what if I actually just got curious what about that caused me to react that way? Let’s dig into that. Right? Let’s write it out. Let’s journal it. Let’s listen to music about it. Let’s try to trigger some emotion in ourselves to go Oh, that’s what that is. That’s what caused me to have that reaction, that response. Instead of immediately being like, I’m stupid. I’m dumb. I’m a failure. I am an idiot. I can’t believe I responded that way. And in the same way, what if we did that with the other people around us?

Hmm, yeah, that’s really, yeah. What an invitation that would be.

Right? Like, what if when somebody reacted so strongly to something, instead of just pouncing and judging them, we were like, hey, wait, let’s just get curious about that.

Yeah, that’s my whole life. Like, that’s what I’ve been struggling with. And that’s why I go to therapy, because I’m always never curious. I’m always defensive. And I’m always blowing up. I mean, it’s better and more God as a better I mean, we’re, my wife and I are on the struggle bus for a while there, but, and we still struggle, but in mostly my fault, but But yeah, that’s what I’m working on is why can I be curious about why she reacted that way? Why do I have to blow up and be like, or be on the defensive? And even though she was not being that way? And I presumed that she was, Yes,

right. And that’s where if you can like get to the root of what the, the root of it, the root of what the judgment is. to be like, Oh, that’s what’s going on? Well, now you can have a conversation with someone. So true.

Yeah. But so I’m gonna challenge you a little bit because I’ve been dealing with this. It’s not as easy as like, knowing what the root problem is. I mean, you talked about brain wiring, which mine was all mines all left up. And I’m hoping over time that those will rewire. But it’s been a it’s been a slow burn. So just naming what it is. I don’t think that will help me two days later, when the same thing comes up.

No, what it does is it just shows you what it is you need to work on.

Oh, yeah, I know what I need to work.

And then and then and then figure out what that is. Yeah. Right. So let me give you like here, I said I’d be vulnerable, because that’s just who I am. Let me give you give you a like a real life example of this. I was watching a TV show a little while ago, and I heard the comment that someone was fat and ugly. And it just, you know, when you just have that like fire in you, and you’re like, Whoa, I didn’t like that. Yeah. And I had this very visceral response to this. And I was like, Oh, that’s interesting. That that triggered a feel and a half. And then I was watching a movie. And I heard that said again. And I had the same kind of reaction A few days later. And I was like, Huh, okay. And because I wasn’t looking at it from a place of judgment, I was just like, well, that caused a really big reaction. What the hell was that? So literally wrote it on a piece of paper. So she’s sitting beside me, I wrote on a piece of paper, and I was like, fat and ugly. What was that? And then I kept going with it. And then my husband was saying something and he said the same thing and I erupted. I was like, why don’t we say that? Why is the society do we put fat and ugly together? That makes no sense because I know some of the ugliest skinny people and some of the most beautiful fat people, and why do we connect these two? Right? And it wasn’t even an eruption like I was mad at him for what he had said it was just like this. Like, all these emotions came out and he kind of sat back and looked at me and he was like, oh, okay, Don, what just happened? And I looked at him and I was like, okay, something in that is triggering me like what the hell is it and he’s like, I don’t know but I’m gonna walk away now cuz I’m not sure what’s going on there. And so in that space, this is exactly what I did. I sat down with a pen and paper and I wrote fat and ugly ugly fat fat and ugly, ugly and fat, fat and ugly, ugly and fat over and over and over and over and over. Until all of a sudden this is what came out of my pen. These people are not loved these people are not successful. And I went Oh, oh, that got deep. Okay. Where is this coming from? Right so I started writing about it I was like, okay, where did this come from? Where did I first hear this? Where did I start to feel this project? Where did I start to feel this? This feeling this emotion? Where did I hear this? And what it came down to? Okay moving on read this but I will tell you guys, is I this is literally like, on my page right here, including the bad word is the reason I’ve held myself Back is because if people have a reason to walk away, because I’m fat because I’m ugly because of a failure, because I’m not rich enough, because I’m not smart enough, I’m not pretty enough, whatever it is, then I have something to blame it on. It’s not because I am unlovable.

That’s deep. Wow.

Right. And I went, Oh, okay. That’s really big. So then I went from there, I was like, okay, so where did that belief come from? Where did that even start? And yes, I can trace it to conversations that I have with my mom and dad, I can trace it to patterns and behaviors that happen in my grandparents house, I can trace it to all of these different things. But deep down at the core of it, if I was willing to look at it without judgment, what it came down to is, at what point in my life did I start rejecting me? At what point did I put that judgment on me? Hmm, that that’s what that meant? Well, now you can face that now you can really look at that in a different light and go, that explains so much of why I behaved the way I do, or why I reacted to those words, or any of those things. Right. And then that could be a conversation that I could have, you know, with my coach, I could be conversation that I have with a friend or with my husband to be like, hey, look what’s coming out of this. That’s pretty intense. Yeah, well, I traced that right back to a moment when I was 12 years old, that I was in a situation where I was drowning. And I very vividly remember not fighting for myself. So I wanted to be dead. So bad, I was okay to drown. And I survived. Obviously, I’m sitting here. But I went right back to that moment where when I really dug into it for myself, I was like, holy, like that’s been years of rejection of myself. Of course, weight gain from a brain aneurysm or whatever would cause me to reject myself at a deeper level. Well, now I can deal with that. Yeah, right. Now I can actually start to process that because I’m willing to face the ugly behind it.

That’s really good. So my follow up question to that is, as we’re talking about trauma, as we’re talking about just how it rewires brains, and it just short circuits so much, so much. My question is, is there anything in your life that stayed the same? And maybe these could be like a foundation or a value? What are the things in your life that stayed the same, even after walking through such painful trauma? Yeah,

you know, a few big ones are scrappy. And came out of the womb scrappy, and that has not ever died. It’s something that, you know, my husband, he’s been around for 25 years now. And he’s like, I love how hard you fight for yourself and everybody around you. He’s lucky just, he’s like, you’re so scrappy, and You’re so stubborn. And it’s like my greatest double edged sword.

Gosh, darn it, my jewel.

Like, the biggest and best double edged sword ever is like my scrappiness or stubbornness. I’m a deep love of people. Like actually really caring and seeing people in a different way. Like, I think I see people through a lens of because I have been at that point where I was so broken and where I’ve hurt that bad. And I’ve I’ve been there I see people in a completely different light. I have more empathy and grace and compassion for people. Then, I could even describe, I don’t know how to even word how much I have. Because I actually really, really care. And my faith, my faith has been my foundation right from the beginning. Hmm.

Yeah, that’s really good. Yeah, man, like I said, at the beginning of the episode, I feel like a lot of our are similar similarities. I mean, caring for other people. I’m, like, always thinking about other people. Now, again, it’s not, it doesn’t always come out correctly. But I do. Like, I really care for my friends. And I, I really care for other people in the community. Like I’m always trying to help and I don’t know what that is like growing up in a shitty home. It’s just like, I mean, you can take two paths, right? You can just be 100% a piece of crap your entire life. And I see people throughout just walking around the world and I see the way like a person acts and I’m like, they probably chose to be a piece of crap or, you know, maybe they’re dealing with something I don’t know. But, you know, there’s really only two paths you either fail Sit or work on it and try to be a better person or you just, you know, ride along what you know, about, like we talked about being nurtured. So

I think one of the best things I ever did for myself as a creative, like a new primary question that I asked myself, and that is, and I asked this to people all the time is like, how can I love you even more right now? And that’s that, how can I love myself even more right now? How can I love my husband? How can I love my family? How can I love my friends? How can I love my clients? But that, that is the filter that everything goes through? Hmm. So when how I am as a human how I am as a spouse, everything right? How can I love you even more right now? And then that becomes almost like my corporate culture, even in my company.

That’s that it’s a good it’s a good thought. And I wish I could do that more often. But I fall into my old patterns a lot. And that’s why I’m working on it.

Which good? I’m glad you’re working on it.

Yes, it’s a it’s a struggle. I’m on the struggle bus quite a bit when, when it comes to that thing,

those things. So all right, well, let’s go. Perhaps a touch deeper. So one thing that I’ve experienced in my life, that I don’t like to talk about, is this stinging sense of being alone, like, not having like, one of my greatest fears is to just not have anybody in my life to relate to or to be with. And it can be hard for me to really be alone with myself. Because in that moment, I am faced with me. And the dude staring back at me when I look in the mirror. And there are times where total vulnerability here, I’ll look in the mirror and I just have this sense of who is that guy? Like, what am I doing in this body, like just kind of a reality check of Whoa, this is really weird. And just not feeling comfortable in my own skin. Or just, I would call it just a huge feeling of alone and not sure where I belong. So with that, just turning the mirror to you, have you ever felt alone and what helped you leave that place of loneliness and, and connect with others and that sort of thing? I was wondering if you could speak to that a little bit?

Totally. I think deep down, I felt alone my entire life. I I have felt like I was too much for anybody and everybody around me. Right from when I was a little kid. Right? I always felt different. I always felt weird. I always felt damaged. It was felt broken. I remember being asked to give my testimony for an event when I was about 2324. And I I laughed. And I was talking to my husband about it. And I was like which three things should I talk about? He was What do you mean? I’m like, I can’t actually say half of that. I’ll lose everybody there. Yeah. Right. Because it was this. I had been so taught to believe I was too much. And so I i boxed myself up and isolated, almost in a self defense mechanism, but also to protect the people around me, I thought. And so struggling with this an ability to bond struggling with, you know, coming from a background where I come from a Mennonite background, we’re family is almost a cult,


And you have to forgive and forget and act like nothing ever happened. And you just constantly turn the cheek and you just, you don’t stand up for yourself and you don’t stand out in the crowd. And right like there’s there were all these limiting beliefs and all of these really like masks that I ended up having to put on to fit in. And so I spent the majority of my life feeling completely alone, totally alone and completely isolated. And I remember one day, my husband was super quiet. He’s super shy. And we’ve been married maybe a few months. And I said I love you and he was like, No, you don’t, but it’s okay. And he kept walking. And I was like, what, what? And yeah, and I was so angry at him and I said what do you mean? And he goes, Don, he’s like, you can’t actually love me until you learn how to love yourself.

Oh, damn.

And he’s like, but that’s okay. I’m not going anywhere. Anyway. walked away. And you know, we were 20 years old. And I was so angry at him, I was so angry. And it took years years where I made that part of my healing. And part of what I fought for was how do I fall in love with me? How do I fall in love with me because the minute I can fall in love with me, then I’m not putting that need onto everybody else around me, which also then takes away from me being like that stinky guy in the room at the bar, like the desperate person, then now All my friends are like, Oh, she’s so needy. Right? And in that, then if I’m falling in love with me, and I love me, I can then be okay with hanging out with me in my own space. Yeah, well, in my own headspace.

Yeah, one of the things I want to bring up is how insightful your husband was at such an early stage of boy of your marriage. I mean, obviously had been together for a while, but just to be like, yeah, yo, like, you need to get your act together with yourself. And then it’s cool. I’ll be here when you do. Like That was pretty

good. It was like a solid seven or eight years before I said, I love you. And he’s like, Yeah, I know. It just started. Wow, great. Like, Oh, no, we my husband, we always joke about it. Like other people. They’re like, he’s like the king of the one liner. Like, he’s so wise, but he doesn’t talk a lot. But when he does, you better listen.

You better listen, cuz it’s good. Wow.

Well, like speaking of one liners. Why? So? As we’re wrapping up what you know, we’re talking about, like, all these different things. And I kind of want to bring it down a little bit. And like, what are some of the most important lessons that you’ve learned through this entire? I’m gonna say it, journey, those journey and pivot are like my triggering words, like when I hear guests say it, and don’t get me wrong, if you’re all a guest. And you’ve heard this before. I just heard, yeah, I roll I roll my eyes in my head. And it’s not you. It’s just that’s, those are what the words are right now. So that’s okay. So it’s through this journey, what what kind of one or two things that stands out that that have been the most impactful for you, as far as learning things.

So here’s some like really easy strategies even to like help your guests get up and start changing their life right now. Okay. And number one is, there’s three steps to do anything and everything that you want in your entire life. one tiny bit of determination, no shame and one tiny action. If you do that over and over, and over, and over and over, you can literally do anything and everything you want in your life. What catches us is the shame. And that’s where you need to stop yourself and be like, what am I judging? Because I’m going to be really honest, the people around you, they’re too busy being obsessed with themselves to actually care what you’re doing.

Yeah, but why? Why

do we think what they do?

Right? We’re so concerned that everybody around us is judging us so harshly. And they’re really not. They’re not even paying attention. Yes, sir. Want, right. So you can do those three things over and over and over, you can do anything. The second thing is don’t stop fighting. So when a doctor is like, Nope, I think this is what’s going on, or a friend tells you or someone in your life where you get the wrong diagnosis, get a second opinion, third opinion, fourth opinion, fifth opinion, if you are going down one path, and you’re not getting the result that you want, and you’re giving it 100%, and it’s not working, find a new path, find a new person, don’t stop fighting, because you never know you never know, when all of a sudden, you are going to land in the right spot, when all of a sudden you’re going to find the right person, when all of a sudden you’re going to hear the right conversation. And that will be the thing that completely rocked your world. And we’re so quick to give up. We’re so quick to give up. You know what if you’re like 100 pages into a 400 page book and you hate it, throw the damn book away, give it away, donate it, you don’t actually have to finish it. And it’s that way with everything in your life. That is that’s like the sons of choosing to suffer.

Yeah, that’s like the sunk cost fallacy right there. I’ve read over 400 of the 500 pages, I have to finish I’ve just invest invested so much time, get rid of it, get rid of it. And that’s what I did with this job. It was not serving me. Well, it was it was putting me into a spot where I was grinding away. And for $0. It’s like, this is my life’s too short. To do this, I have more important priorities. So I want 100% 100%.

And you know what, nobody can make us feel a feel. Nobody, nobody else can do anything to fix us, heal us change us. They can influence us. And that’s it. And the good news is that that means that we get to choose our emotions. We get to choose how we feel we get to choose how we move forward. We can had to choose those things. The problem is it also means that we can torture ourselves.

Hmm, what’s very true? So one of the things you, you mentioned, just one follow up question, and then we’ll kind of start climbing out. But one of the things I heard you talk about was this idea that everybody’s watching us. And so my background before getting into sales, which I’ve been doing for the last six years, I mean, that’s another story in and of itself. introvert, anxious person doing sales. It’s exciting. Yeah, it has been fun to talk more about that later. But, but where I’m going with that what I went to school for was youth ministry. And I was a youth pastor, and I am an ordained minister, and I still do weddings on the side. So but one of the concepts that we were taught in college was a major part of adolescence is that idea of the invisible audience that when you’re a teenager, you feel like all eyes are on you. Now that was taught within the context of adolescence. But I would say, it’s not just adolescence that face that, and maybe this is a new thing. And maybe it’s because adolescence has become a prolonged thing, this generation, but I really feel strongly that that idea of the invisible audience that people are always watching you. It’s not just limited to teens or young adults, like that’s a thing. Throughout. So yeah, I just wanted to get your feedback on that. Do you? Are you familiar with the, the adolescent boundary on that? Or do you think it’s something that can also continue to manifest?

How does it not manifest when that’s what you’ve been so ingrained in as a teenager?

Right? Yeah, right. And

so much of that even I think when you’re a kid is done in a fear factor way of the whole world is watching you, everybody’s watching you, they’re all judging you, you better behave because everyone’s eyes are on you, and everyone’s paying attention to you. And then we grow up, and we still think that everybody cares, and everyone’s paying attention. But if you were to sit down and be like, okay, who do I think about on a daily basis? How often Am I thinking about them? And what am I thinking about them? really stop and think about that? Yeah, right. And then think about how many people you actually know and are in your sphere of influence? Do the math, what percentage of people are you actually giving that much of your energy to to stress out about them and pay attention to everything that’s going on? This might be totally inappropriate. But I was talking to someone about this one day, and I said, I don’t think you understand how little people even see each other. Yeah, well, I mean, we were walking through a mall, and I literally just started like playing with my boobs. And I was like, is anyone noticing? And she was like, nobody. And I was like, ya know, because everyone is so self absorbed with their own life in their own cell phone in their own worlds, their own identity. And what if someone is watching me? They’re not actually thinking about you. Right, and I think that we allow the world to control our actions and our behaviors, when really they don’t care.

Yeah, it’s so true. So true.

Like, the only time they’re actually gonna care is when you’re like, posting it all over the world and asking for everybody’s opinions on something, right? Because then you’re like laying it out for them on a silver platter. And if they happen to even like slowed down as they’re swiping to be like, oh, look what Johnny’s doing.

Yeah, that’s probably one thing I’ve taken away from this episode is, is that just I really appreciate like, I need to have more, more often say, No one gives a shit. Like, no one. Not all about me, right? Yeah.

here’s, here’s a good one for you that I think you’ll appreciate. Stop buying into this bullshit story in your head. Yeah, so

good. That will probably reduce a lot of anxiety to No kidding. Yeah.

It’s so true. Oh, man. Don, I feel like there are so many different directions that we can keep going on. And we’re coming up to the end of our time slot. I just want to say thank you so much. This has been absolutely incredible. As we kind of climb out from the deep end, I want to just give you the opportunity to share one piece of parting wisdom that you would like to leave with our listeners, you damn you’ve left so many already. I mean, this has just been peppered with these amazing insights. So thank you for that. But anything else you want to add? As we wrap up?

It doesn’t matter how hard it is. It doesn’t matter how rough it feels. It doesn’t matter how broken you think you are at the core of who we are. We’re all like a Mr. Potato Head. The core of us is solid and amazing. Sometimes we just have parts in the wrong spots. So keep fighting. Keep fighting Because there’s so much more life ahead of me. And it is so good on the other side.

That’s amazing. Well said, Well, we want to give you the opportunity also to share a little bit about how our listeners can find you. I’m sure. After hearing all of these amazing nuggets of truth and badass read, they probably want to connect. So how can people find you?

Absolutely. So I do a Facebook Live with a free coaching and insight every single Wednesday on my Facebook page, the Taylor way. You can find me there on my website, the Taylor Or you can even send me an email Hello at the Taylor And I love to connect to people on on my website. You can also sign up for my newsletter that has some cool stuff on it. I have a YouTube channel, Instagram the Taylor right now. I’m all over the place.

Yeah, it’s it’s tough, isn’t it? That that’s why you have a team Ben and I need a team. Yes, seriously.

Recommend. Right,

right. Hold on. Thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate the time the thoughtfulness. I know we went a little long, but sometimes you just can’t cut stuff off when when things are we’re talking about is so good. So I appreciate that.

Thank you for having me.

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