Transcription #144

Hi guys, welcome to threads podcast life unfiltered. Thank you so much for joining us tonight for Episode 144, mainly mental health bucket. That’s what Ben wrote on the title. So I read I’m like Ron Burgundy, I read whatever’s in front of me. So wherever you’re listening, we really appreciate you guys. And before we jump into the mainly mental health bucket that’s going to tell us what threads podcast is all about. And then we’ll introduce our guests.

Well, threads is mainly about mental health and faith, and uncomfortable conversations. This is a show where it’s okay for us to talk about things that are difficult to address things that might be taboo. Otherwise, we really want to create a space where it’s okay to talk about the things that are tough in life, and not just about the things that we like to put on social media to make our life look perfect. We want to talk about the opposite stuff, too. As we do that, we tend to focus a lot on mental health. And you’ll probably hear that tonight. And as we go through all of these conversations, our main intent is to find those threads that tie us all together, instead of focusing on all the things that separate us and divide us and pull us apart. This is a space where we can be real, and also find those connections that exist between us. And that is what threads is all about.

Thank you, Ben. I mean really, mainly all about. So tonight, we have Megan and Neff in to record on Sunday night, and we go way back, but we were never close. She’s been on the show before. So if you’ve been a longtime thready I couldn’t tell you what episode is a good long time. A good host would have looked that up and reference it but Ben will probably look it up for me. But yeah, so we’ve we’ve you’ve been on before you. We grew kind of grew up together. What do you like? Well, you’re not supposed to ask a woman at what years you graduate high school. That’ll

2002 Okay.

So you’re eight years. Well, that disproves how old you are, but whatever. I graduated 94. So we didn’t really ever know each other. Now we live two doors down, right. two doors down. So yeah. Good old neighborhood. And you live pretty close. You You’re real close.

I am my kids go to the elementary school I went to so Oh, just right around the corner. Yeah. All right. So very cool. I enjoy the neighborhood.

Yeah, I enjoyed parts of it. When I was growing up. And so yeah, you’re you work for Irvine’s and you have two kids and a husband. Husband Brian works from home. Yep. Still.

Yes. And he has even before COVID Yeah. I think yeah, it

was a normal thing. I don’t know how he does that, by the way. Like, I mean, I know you probably couldn’t stay home. No, it

drives me nuts. Yeah, I need to see people, right? Yeah.

I, me too. I’m kind of the same way. So um, we wanted to bring you on just to kind of talk a little bit about mental health. And that’s something that you and I have connected over. Over the last I don’t know, two years we’ve gone out we’ve probably talked more about that than anything else in your your business sponsors. Our other show we probably talked more about mental health and yeah, there. Which whatever like it’s, it’s totally fine. But, but before we jump into the interview, we’d like to just do an icebreaker. So how is everyone showing up tonight? Ben, I’m gonna let you go first. You’ve had a crazy busy weekend. How are you showing up?

I think it’s the same answer I gave last week. I’m tired. Weekends have become like these three days where I have so much going on. And then I look forward to the week so I can kind of chill out and calm down. So I’ve just got too much going on. I’m in an improv class. I’ve been hitting up both services at church because apparently I’m just so holy, I don’t know. And and then add into that just family stuff. And late night last night with our guests from last week. Stefan Oh, yeah.

Did you see my blank? I’m like, are you party with?

It was it’s just been. It’s been a weekend and I’m tired. But I’m trying to rally. So that’s how I’m showing up.

What about you, Megan?

I’m tired too. And I don’t enjoy Sunday nights typically. So it was nice to have things switched up for me.

Yeah. Do you get the Sunday blues of like, it’s back to the grind. Like this Sunday? scaries? Yeah. skerries Yeah, there’s

nothing scary about what’s happening in this next week. It’s, it’s normal, but it’s just like the like the mental load of what’s happening in the next week.

As everyone uses planners, they’re great. But when you look at him for your week, you’re like, sweet Jesus, like this is so much I have to pack it and then we’re, we’re gone on the weekend for the holiday. So I’m like, I gotta pack all this in Monday through Wednesday. stary here. We have a Thursday. And you’re just like, Ah,

yeah. So I Sunday scaries. But we had baseball earlier today. I got my groceries ordered as I’m scrolling through and picking replacements while we’re sitting here. Sorry, but yesterday we had a really fun work event. We went on the grand lady with everybody and their parents from work. Oh, wow. Interesting. Yeah, like it was everybody and it was one of our guys really wanted to go and I was like the ladies really went and there was a band and

beer and like the steamboat. Not it’s a boat that just goes down the river boat, the big story one, why’d you say it sucks, like,

cuz last time it did, but there was like, good drinks and are open. So it was a little bit more fun. And you know, being with our co workers, we don’t really see each other outside of work often. So that was really fun.

I appreciate I assume you guys are good bosses. Your mom and dad say I am not Yeah, they are great. Yeah. It’s so refreshing to have someone that cares for you, and pays you what you’re valued and doesn’t have to work, you know, 60 hours a week and those kinds of things. So

yeah, it’s a good I think it’s a great place to work. I have a little more flexibility than everybody else. But of course, we just had a new guy start with us. His name is Towner. They moved from Bellingham Washington to Michigan without ever being here. What to

take this job? No Oh, okay. They were just like adventure

adventure and they moved here and so like his family, like he and his wife are here with their two kids and her mom happened to be here. So she came and just everybody everybody was together and it was really nice. Very cool,

so maybe we should do that. It’s probably all in the season though. Right? I wonder if they do them into September sorry, the riverboat Oh my God.

They do it all the time. So


I mean, if they got drinks, I’m down like right? cocktails. The band was kind of like, but what kind of was a great 80s or, like older music but it was fine. Now I would say older than 18 Okay, thank you. No, I like 80s Yeah, babies are amazing a little bit older than that but it was still good if it fit everybody was happy the kids were all happy.

Yeah, all right. And then I’m showing up tonight I’m feeling okay other than I got stung by a yellow jackets on Friday night. I have every year in August I’ll get a ground nest on my Hill. It’s not even that big of a hill it’s out out there in the back and it was right next to the grass and you are to the edge of the grass and usually I see him you know coming did not see him got hit in the like in the shin bone right here. And then I started running because like I didn’t know where the nest was like normally if I can assess it, I can I would just step away from the nest. I mean I got the one in my shin and just let go the more and ran and then another one got me in the back of my calf on the other side. They are still incredibly itchy. It’s been over 48 hours. I don’t know what to do. I’ve taken Benadryl I put cream on it like right now they’re incredibly itchy, both legs, and so it’s annoying as hell i i’ve apparently never been stung by Yellowjackets before because I don’t remember it being this it’s not painful. I mean it was painful when it happened

right? Shin Okay, I

ran out I went out one minute later and continued to mow no not that spot it is unmowed right now tomorrow they will be dying so enjoy your last night of right

now do you pour gas on it and let the hill on fire because I feel like maybe we should do that tonight. If I while they’re sleeping if

I didn’t work for a company that does pest control for wasp. I probably wouldn’t but I will be spraying something down there and they will be all dead. So yeah, that is how I’m coming in. But uh yeah, it’s been a long weekend did a my long run yesterday nine miles. Jason and Jason third person talking here. Our buddy Mike and I are going to run a half marathon this fall. So yep, it was it was a long nine miles

on this heat. How early did you go

I started at 650 so but I mean when I got done everything was wet. I just come home and stripped it all off the washer so yeah, and then he went for like a 15 mile bike ride last night and same thing 500

Yeah, it was brutal. Usually there’s like a ton of people on the trail. But not last night it was me and maybe five other people that I encountered so introvert me loved it but sweaty me did not

this guy’s a cycle on the bike. We went we’ve gone one time, he almost ran this old lady over. Like, there was like traffic coming in instead of him just you know, I don’t know, slowing down. He like walks around or she rings her bow like she was mad. I was like, Who is this guy? This is something I would do and he’s just like

Got this all terrain bike like I can go anywhere. So I do, like, I’ll just buzz around people, I’ll go off on the shoulder of the trail on.

This was like 10 feet from the river. You were like

it was awesome. But yeah, well the last question that I have, we did something that was a first and that was bringing on a a minor onto our show, who actually ended up having more of a potty mouth than you did. Which was something Yeah. How

did you feel when he said dick?

I laughed. I thought it was appropriate. I

mean, he’s almost 16 minutes. You know, he talks like that. Oh, um,

I hear him when he’s gaming. So I wouldn’t

let that out. Although I do, I swear to but it’s weird as as a 15 year old to be swearing when he’s in your basement or wherever games, but that’s just me.

Yeah. So it was a first because he’s a minor. And also, it’s the first time we had a kid, like one of our kids on the show kid and genuine in general. Yeah. And I thought it was going into it. I was like, This is either gonna be awful, or it’s gonna be great. And I didn’t quite know what to expect. So I just thought based on it being so new, I figured I’d get you guys’s input. How did you think that episode?

Probably hasn’t listened to it yet? No, actually, I

did. Oh, I’m usually behind. But I’m trying to be better since I miss big life things.

Yeah, she found out that she met or talked to my sister. I’m like, I don’t know what what did she say that? Oh, no. Was it the COVID know

how I started. I was like, Yeah, I was supposed to go to your brother’s house tonight. But he got COVID. And she was like, What? And I was like, oh, yep, guys aren’t talking to each other. But Ben caught up on all the episodes to know, like, I knew where we were. And then yeah, it’s just so

then I must have just gave you the information about my dad then. Right? Well, I had

found a lot of it out earlier. But like I didn’t know where everybody stood. Like as of two weeks ago, right? Yeah. And so then I got anxiety and it was like, Jason, I’m so sorry. Oh, gee, sister. Oh,

dude, I don’t care. Like, even if it was my other sister who I pretty much on the despise level right now. I would have been fine with that. I’m not like that. I just still felt like I was like, well, as a human. You would feel bad. I mean, doesn’t matter. Yeah.

Megan actually texted me, which is why I put this on the rundown because I thought her comment was hilarious.

Yeah, what? Oh, sorry. I thought my sister Megan. So anyways, go ahead.

Yeah, because I was like, man, I kind of want to be friends with your kid. He’s like, he seems so he seems so much cooler than me. Really? Um, I mean, listen, I’ve not I don’t even know if I’ve ever actually I don’t I cannot picture him in my brain. So I mean, maybe if I sound like no way I’m way cooler. But just the way that he was talking. He was able to. Well, so could he. Give me any ideas, right. Just the way he was able to have conversations and seemed very confident in the things he was saying. I was like, dang, this kid’s cool.

Yeah, he hung pretty well. He has, like a, like an accent. He’s got this. It sounds a little gang. like yeah, that is that is

that’s how he talks with his friends. Okay, pulled it out on the show. I heard it too. Yeah. And I wasn’t hearing it. Yeah, it is almost like a gang. Like a tough guy. Like Yeah, just the way he says certain phrases. It’s like he’s from the street or something. Yes.

And I was like, there’s no way he talks to his dad like, no. I mean, I thought that was funny. But no, it was a great show. I was very impressed of how I was worried about the Yes, no answer, right. I was just like, oh, man, Ben, we’re, it’s gonna be rough. But he came, he did exactly what we wanted him to do. And it was a good show

was Yeah, I agree. Well, let’s jump into tonight’s episode. So when I heard that Megan was coming on the show, I was stoked. And there’s a big reason for that. Back in June, Jason and I had a moment. Pretty, pretty crucial moment, one life of threads.

While we may have had a, we have lots of moments together.

This is true. This is always fighting. Very true. There’s, it’s like we are the opposite of each other in a lot of ways. But then there’s also areas where we think alike, and so needless to say, we end up butting heads more often than maybe we should, but we always find our way through our differences, which is refreshing. But in June, there was probably some stuff going on between Jason and I am sure. But there was also this level of maybe dissatisfaction like, why are we doing this every week? Nobody’s reaching out. Is this even moving the needle for anybody who’s listening like We have offered free dinner if you write a review and nobody’s biting, it’s like, we’re talking into this echo chamber. And it’s so frustrating. And so I was ready to quit. I think Jason was

just to pull the curtain back. podcasting has no, you get no feedback. And it’s not just us. Obviously, if you’re a higher level, like Zayn and stuff, you get, you know, you get the groupies and stuff and that that give feedback. And but it’s just it’s, people just don’t do that people like to lurk behind the episodes and listen. And so, yeah, that’s kind of where we were at. We’re like, Is anything happening? Hello, Is this thing on? Basically, yeah.

And then we’re questioning whether this thing is on. And Megan reaches out to Jason, with this amazing text of your show, like, is doing something for me, and I’m doing a terrible job of paraphrasing it, but I’ll hand it over to Megan to kind of tell us the in between that I’m missing. But for that message to come through at that point in time, it was so encouraging. And there’s just people in life who you meet once or twice, or maybe it’s people who just randomly pop in your life, or maybe it’s even people you know, your entire life, but just to have somebody regardless of depth of relationship that offers encouragement. I feel like it’s so rare. And when you offer those words of encouragement, I was just like, Alright, I’m good to go for a while now. There are people listening, this isn’t just some echo chamber is this thing on like, Okay, this is actually making a difference.

So remember the lawn I was at, I remember the street I was on, and I have a terrible I was on Maple lawn Street, it is a court, I can picture the house, because him and I had been messaging like 20 minutes before that. And then I pulled up to park and you send that text. I’m like, dude, check this out. Like it was so it was it was so impactful. It meant so much. Yeah. I mean, you can say what you said on the text. I don’t remember.

I don’t have a clue what I said, Yeah, I

had my phone off. I don’t know, I could turn but it was just about you and your husband, and how hard this can be and you know, mental health in general. So that was the gist of it. So

Well, I’m glad that it hit when it did. Oh, I was standing. I know I was at work. And I was listening to something and life just has not been easy. For anybody since the last time I was here, right? Maybe I was here in February. We’re, I think it was 2020.

It was like a month before the pandemic. It

was February 7 2020. Right before the world went to shit. Wow. Yeah.

Interesting. So and at that time, you guys were like getting therapy, getting therapy. And I was like, Man, it’s fine. Yeah, whatever. And then Jason every once in a while, check in Hey, how’s it going? But anyways, I know, we’re I know, we’re gonna go through everything. But I don’t remember what I said in that text message I have been trying to be mindful of when I think of someone, or when something is making a difference, to stop what I’m doing and send a text because I think I’m gonna send a card. I’m never gonna, there’s no chance I’m never going to do that’s

such a good philosophy to try to, if you if you feel it, do it, like, well, within reason, but I mean, but I totally get that if you don’t do it in the time. You won’t do it right? And then you’ll be pissed at two weeks later, you’ll see a text threatening and be like, Oh my gosh, why didn’t I send that? Right? I was thinking about them,

right? And I just think, you know, it would be more impactful to me if someone was like, hey, Megan data, data data, I was thinking of you because of this. So obviously that was meant to be sent to you and it was meant to be sent to you. So it was

it was impactful because I struggle with those quote unquote God moments. And Ben and I always go back and forth and I always do the examples are God in this water bottle? And he’s bent like yes, and I’m like, You’re stupid. He made the people that made the plastic and he put the things in the earth and what

he says is the living water yeah. Oh, yeah. So this is

holy water here. Okay. So I it felt like a god moment to me and I actually said that to him. Because it did I mean, it was just like, No, we weren’t gonna probably dissolve in that moment. But it was just I think we were closer than we ever were before. Yeah, and I want I want people to listen like when you hear this, it doesn’t mean that we’re constantly thinking of quitting it’s just it’s a lot of work with it. You know what I mean? And we don’t do it because we want to be I mean, I guess a Spotify Oh, said we’ll pay $100,000 for the show. I mean, I wouldn’t say no, but But um, we do it because Ben and I, it’s been huge for us just talking about, you know, mental health in general. That’s almost ready to be a quitter, but Well, we’ll maybe we’ll talk about that a little bit. But why don’t you talk about a little bit about your mental health. Check. My journey your trip with you maybe with your whatever you want to share as far as with Brian and those kinds of things because Megan and I are going to counseling together too. So my my Megan Yeah, for those that are I have a sister Megan friend Megan wife, Megan, friend and sister spelled the same mine doesn’t so none of that matters. But ours are spelled the right

name. Oh yeah, so I was diagnosed with ADHD in seventh grade. So I think that could probably be like where I start my mental health journey. And it is something that I’ve fully circled back on, especially in the past year and a half is reasons Well, just paying attention to it and realizing why things are the way they are in my brain. Yeah, why I function the way that I do. But so starting in seventh grade, when on meds that was good, I think my mom had me in therapy for a while and I know she went because she felt so guilty about not knowing that I had it earlier. And then it was all good through high school. I had my first panic attack probably when I was a senior in high school. Got on Lexapro it was brand new then, huh Yes, and then I kind of rode the Lexapro train through college, I dropped out of college to have a quick little stay at Pine rest, and then Highland hospital. So went on a lot of meds. Probably more than I should have been on, came back off them and got to reclaim my life, which was, I feel like a God thing truly because as soon as I was out of the hospital, and I was able to go, my mom and dad let me because I was 20 something years old and they did let me leave and go visit my best friend Katie in Indianapolis where I met Brian

Yeah, I remember the story. Yeah, it was at a bar just a random

thing was church if my dad asks, sorry, sorry, dad. No, it was a bar. And

a church with alcohol for

every Catholic Church. I think good ones they probably don’t do that anymore. Do they? Or do they? Oh, they have the old school ones probably do, aren’t they? Oh, no. But like Jane’s they don’t do that. Yeah, so anyway, sorry. Rabbit squirrel.

I’ll jump right on. So let’s see. So after I met Brian was coming off meds still because I was on so many. And when we met I told him everything upfront like it was instant we just I let it all out. Yeah. And he kind of told me some of his shit too. Yeah, can we say shit?

Yes. You can say whatever you want. I will beat the F word though.

I know you’ll still know it’s there. If Stefan says dick you can say shit. Well,

I pretty much say everything well, not everything.

Got it?

The basics.

And then we ended up getting married I moved to Indianapolis for a while things were racking my mental health was not great. And I got pregnant with Bryson with our oldest and things really evened out for me. And my mental health was good without meds for a good chunk of time though after the after you had Bryson like when I was pregnant, I went off my meds. So usually it’s the opposite people like have a kid to like, fix stuff, and it makes it 10 times worse. But no,

I know. That’s not what you did

it No, just like my anxiety. Like, I feel like I probably had kind of higher anxiety about being pregnant and like things that could happen, then other people do. But even until Hayden, my daughter after she was born. I was probably good. Like, my anxiety and depression stuff was gone for probably three or four years. Do you think

it’s because you were so busy with kids that you didn’t have time to think about it?

I wonder if it was hormone related? I really do. I could be so I don’t have a clue. But um, I went back on meds and then had a hysterectomy. So more harm on staff. Oh, okay. And then well, yeah, so I had the hysterectomy in December of 2018. Okay, so now things I feel like are kind of evening out in my body. It’s been long enough. It should be evened out at this point. But who knows. Um, and things just kind of started spiraling with panic attacks and stuff. And I was doing pretty good. Only every now and then and like intrusive thoughts, but COVID hit. And I think that everybody’s mental health just took a nosedive. My aunt passed away in November from COVID which was awful. And that kind of threw Brian for a loop that kept passing away or I think I don’t, he was up for a med change. I talked to him a little bit about what I was allowed to talk about with him. Obviously I’m not gonna go very good idea. I’m not gonna go into his story, but he needed a med change. And I think that was kind of the kick in the ass that he needed to do it. So he had a really rough couple of months and I think that’s kind of like where it started. So we both got a hold of our mental health in that in that time in a big way, because we didn’t have a choice. Yeah. So I was kind of in survival mode and honestly, So was he in a whole different like he just needed to get back on meds and have them work in his body. So we kind of got to work hand in hand through that, even though neither one of us wanted to be doing it, right. So, during that situation, Brian was seeing all of Sorry, I’m going around Brian’s story, but they’re just so intertwined. At this point. It makes sense. Brian was seeing his therapist through pine rest, and he was like, I’m just not clicking with her at all. No, this

is during COVID this was this. This January. Okay, so it was all telehealth and yes,

I listen, I love telehealth. I love it. I love it. I love it. Why? Man just convenience. Yes,

you know 100% my therapist said that it’s like 30% have gone back to in person the rest of them are still telehealth because of the convenience Yeah, like I get it and I’m a convenience guy but I don’t know I just don’t i don’t the energy is not there for me like I go true. which is surprising for me because I like all that tech stuff and even before COVID we we had better help as a sponsor. Better Health better help. I did say it right great job Yeah, well, we did have them as a sponsor is it as bad as saying that you guys fix Tesla’s

don’t fix Tesla’s? I’d love to I fixed that

on the next episode did Yeah, I did. I didn’t post it on social but I said just for everyone. They don’t I didn’t know that for for some reason in my head when you added the Eevee. I was like, ah, sweet, but I wish there’s a lot of extra. There’s a lot more EBS than just just so But anyways, I totally lost my train of thought, oh, telehealth, yeah. And it’s I you know, we had them as a sponsor, and then I started doing it. I’m like, I’m not feeling the connection. I feel like in person, like even Ben says, when we do remote interviews with people hate him, he hates him because he will get distracted. And he’ll do stuff on his computer. Or look at Facebook. I know he’s looking at other stuff when we’re talking to people. And I get it I I sometimes do too, especially if the guest is kind of not boring, because I don’t want to insult anyone, but we’ve had a few that have been a little weird. But when you’re in the room, you can just feel the energy. Yeah, even you can feel it if it’s bad or good, right? I mean, so

and you can’t really read the room when you’re virtual. No,

no, and some people do virtual our virtual interviews with no camera. Oh, like, yeah, like a phone call. And we really can’t read the room. You’re constantly interrupting. You can’t see anything crazy. So he was um, he was doing the telehealth thing. Yeah, this January.

Yep. And his meds all kicked in. And he’s he’s good to go. Everything. We are good. We are back to normal. Yeah, whatever are normal, right. But that med change is something that I don’t feel like a lot like people talk about when you have to change meds when you’ve been on them for so long. That is

awful. It is

down to the one and then you have to build back up. So it feels like you have to go through withdrawal symptoms. Yes. coming off of something and then you have to build slowly back up. So it just feels like you have no, like there’s nothing there. In the meantime, what

why can’t they like slowly build up while you’re weaning off the other one?

I don’t know that they didn’t. Yeah, I’m sure I can’t remember.

So meds probably can’t do that. And some can, I don’t know, I added a second med. And I just slowly added it with the full dose of my other one. Yeah. And that seemed to be okay.


I mean, I hear you, my daughter had to spend time at a inpatient facility just for the purposes of making it through the med change. Because it can be intense and it can be I mean, for an adult like, I know for me, even in changing meds or decreasing or increasing whatever, I would get these horrible brains apps like those moments of like and it just interrupts everything you lose your train of thought it was happening while I was driving like okay, this is just not safe.

I still don’t know what he means by a brain. Oh,

I do like it’s like an electrocution. Yeah, brain and it kind of makes you a little bit dizzy there for a second. It’s an it’s a real thing. Oh, sure. It is. It is awful. Hmm. And it makes you feel like you’re like, lose about two. Yeah, like yeah, Hey, I just had a stroke. That’s that. Yeah, that’s what that was. You

feel entirely out of control? Because like a few seconds, yeah. Because your brain is, is it’s dependent on this chemical. You’re not giving it to your brain anymore. So it’s sending a message like, hey, feed me, feed me feed me. I’m gonna zap you until you give me what I want. And it’s very altering and that was the worst for For me, and it was, I know, I’m going to go to my safe space and say this next sentence, but it was traumatic, like that experience of the brain zaps and not being able to control them predict them. No one they’re happening like, I’m with you mad changes are the worst.

And there’s not much you can do about it. If you’ve got to change, you’re mad, you gotta, you gotta do it. You just got to suck it up. And yeah, try to get through it. But so he goes through the made mad change. And then,

so in this time, while he’s doing therapy, I had been seeing my own therapist last summer, work through some good stuff, but then she just kind of like, vanished. I could never make another outward. And you know what I was like, you know what that means? Like, this wasn’t meant to be, and it’s fine. And I just kind of let it go. But then, through all of Brian’s stuff, and having to like, deal with cadet school and COVID and doing all the normal things that we do, we really realize that we are terrible at communication. I mean, we’re very bad at it. I’m probably bad at communication with everyone. He’s pretty good about it. Like, at work. He’s a very effective communicator. We just don’t do well together.

How do you you feel? Do you feel like you’re a bad communicator? Just with him? Or in general?

No, I’m a bad communicator. Hmm.

But you’re such a outspoken, have fun social, I feel like that’s how you are just because

I say a lot of things doesn’t mean there’s a lot of substance by that. Well, and that’s and that’s it. So we started going to therapy together, we call it communication class. Like that’s what we call it because he grew up in a family where there was yelling, and I grew up in a family where I still have not seen my parents fight. I mean, they’ve been married for I don’t know, 35 years, and I’ve not seen them fight. I’ve seen them frustrated with each other, but I’ve never seen them like raise their voices at each other or anything like that. So we kind of came from the two extremes. I Brian came from a loud family so he shuts down when when there is conflict, and I’m I get louder, cuz I’m like, why aren’t we talking What’s happening? So we have had to, like work together to figure out how to communicate well, and we have been going weekly, since probably May. Wow, okay. Oh, meekly? Uh, huh. Damn, girl.

Good word tents.

So I mean, we we get that deductible right away. So that’s so bad.

Yeah, I feel like my story was around relationship. Maybe the communication, we’re at the same point with my wife, Megan. We didn’t get to that the same way you guys did. But it’s definitely that’s what we’re struggling with. Like we’re not, I’m not gonna say we’re great parents. But when we come together to parent, we’re great. We communicate. We don’t undermine each other, those kind of things. But when it came to us, you know, Megan is same thing. I came from a loud home. And I continue to be loud, I don’t get quiet, like Brian. And Megan came from a home where she didn’t see her parents fight either. And so there’s no conflict resolution. So over time, it’s been we’ve been married, I think it’ll be terrible. We’re married and oh, six of

15 years.

  1. Okay. 15, how soon? So and we bit we were together two years before that. So we’ve been together a long time and have grown a lot. But what’s happening to us is, we’re both going to therapy. So where I used to lean on her because I came from a broken home, and I didn’t know how to do anything. Now we’re both just doing this. You know, people can’t see it, but just parallel lines. And to some point where I’m even going this way. Like, I don’t need you anymore. Like I don’t say that, but I’m like, I got this and I find myself being more wanting to be alone. Sounds like me. Not that bad. Hang on. I don’t say I’m darker.

When you say you like I don’t need you anymore. Are you talking to your therapist? Or your wife? I’m

sorry, my wife. Oh, my bad. Yeah. I know. Nothing to say I don’t need I don’t need her for my emotional well being.

You don’t need her like you needed her before. Right? Do you need her? Of course, in a very different context.

Yeah. And instead of us leaning in together, you know, we’re kind of and she’s and Megan’s getting better, too. She would always be like trying to be the fixer or whatever. And now she’s like, I don’t need to fix this. And so we’re just going straight up and down. So yes, got to communication issues in a different way. But kind of similar where we’re at right now. So how has it been going between you two as far as what are you working on? I’m curious.

It’s hard, just having conversations and like, you know, like, reflecting back on what we say and clarifying and like, Yeah, not throwing things in and I am the fixer. I am the fixer Brian shuts down. I am the people people pleaser. So I am constantly trying to fix things when I can’t.

When it’s not your responsibility, try to fix other people’s feelings. No, you can’t control how other people feel. That’s very hard for me. It’s very hard for my wife to like, that’s what she tries to do. Yeah,

it’s ridiculously hard. So he and I, and our therapist name is Sam. We work so hard to have effective communication. We are not great at it. Yeah. But you know, we will see things like every week we’re like oh, look at that, like we didn’t even have to go to therapy to do that one. So while it seems excessive that we go once a week and have been for the majority of the year like it’s making a difference

it’s got to be absolutely i mean it and you guys are able once a week like well so ours are all cash we don’t have any insurance with that we have insurance but it’s a long story. Well I’m sure you’ve heard how much I hate party health but I’ll cut that out maybe going

you have to cut that out does it work for spectrum? Yeah, who cares it’s the same company

no spectrum owns Priority Health Yeah, that’s the problem you should cut that out the FTC should have stepped in and said this is weird. Hospital should not own an insurance crane But anyways, I digress. Asked going every week I mean it’d be 150 bucks a week. Yeah. And we’re already going to our our own therapist that we that we pay cash for so I mean, we could find a couple well, couples therapy. They don’t cover couples therapy does your insurance company cover it? Or are you as one of them the primary one of you the primary patient with Sam

I I don’t honestly I don’t have a clue

yet because most insurance companies don’t cover it would still be worth it.

I still think it would be what yeah what Yeah,

but that being said I don’t think going every week is excessive I’m actually jealous about it because we could get more work done yeah, you know what I mean? So

definitely we and it’s like my I even though I come out most of the time crying happy or sad like I’m going to cry every single time I just I just cry and that makes Brian very uncomfortable. So he is yes, that’s one of the things he’s working on is like dealing with like me and my crying

that’s interesting. I have gone the full spectrum like I’m mad because Megan’s a crier, too. Yeah, that’s how she shows her emotion. I went from like, oh, you’re doing that just to to to not even making a reaction to not care anymore to trying to say Oh, is this this cry? Or is this this cry?

And it’s sometimes it’s just freakin crying. Yeah, the body comes out does it just does it Yeah, so thanks yeah, it’s not my fault I was made this

way. I was just thanking God in general.

Thanks and that’s hard for him is when when I’m crying because a lot of people don’t see happy cries when they’re growing up and like we just happy cry all the time. So anyways, the crying is a little hard for him sometimes but it is my absolute favorite hour of the week and I don’t know if that’s because like it’s time just for us because it’s not it’s not fun no it’s got a couple it’s totally like yeah, like it’s not like we’re gonna go in and be like we did so great on this this this and this you can go in and start that way and then you know they’re gonna find something and you you’re gonna have to work on it so but it continues to be my favorite time of the week

how however each year brains as far as things that you’re working on to be tangible so for like me, I need like, I will need to work on these three things. Is that something that resonates with you? Or are you you know what I’m talking about like, Okay, you go into class you go into therapy and you’re like Sam wants she wants you to you know like mega night check in every Monday now and we actually created that ourselves thank you very much have a most impressive have not missed I’m freaking proud of that so yeah, but um the SAM do that like tangible things or is it just kind of like wow when this comes up because he that’s a problem they give you talk about these situations, right? And these tools, and then you go for a month and nothing happens that you can use it but then the month comes it’s a month away and you forget what she told you and then you screw up.

Yeah, no, I don’t know that she’s ever said like, hey, like, we’re gonna do this, this and this this week. Okay. Like, usually it’s like one thing. And so like, we’ll just focus on it. But you

know what I mean by tangible like, we’re going through a book went through Bernie, Bernie brown a brown. Doing it again, Ben. I’m forgetting it, and then it pops into my head. He just said this before. Yeah, I know. I’m an idiot. But anyways, we’re going through her book, one of her books. And so that to me, that’s tangible. That’s something I can like, do physically, I guess, and not just emotionally.

Oh, yeah. See, I don’t care about that. No, no, Brian doesn’t care about that either. I don’t think so. I don’t, I’ll ask him. Sure. Yeah. But yeah, so we see Sam once a week, and then he has his own therapist that he sees. And then I also have my own therapy. So we all spend a lot of money on therapy. So that’s great, great money to spend. But

yeah, it is worth it. It really is worth it. But yeah, it is, especially when you get no insurance. frickin

No kidding. So insurance isn’t the only the only issue with seeking help. There’s also, I don’t know if you’ve encountered it, Megan. But there’s also stigma that you have to get through, like this idea of, if I go to therapy, then I’m not blank enough. I’m not good enough, or I, I don’t have what it takes. And so it’s like, not only are those insurance and financial constraints limiting, but then once those are worked out that sometimes you have to work out the whole stigma aspect. Have you experienced that in your experience? Or is Brian, what does stigma look like for you guys? And did you have to overcome it?

So I had none. Like, really, since the time I was young. You know, my mom found out when I met my mom, when my parents found out that I had ADHD, she went to therapy and I went to therapy. Yeah, then she was like, you’re good. didn’t really have a great experience, obviously, around that whole pine rest impatient thing. And bouncing back from that, like it was kind of like I re met people. Because I was on a whole load of medicine. So kind of having to go back and explain that or

you acted like different than you maybe would have been as

well. And I don’t remember any of it. That’s true. Like, I remember nothing. And so like that kind of part of it is, is a little bit what’s sad to me that I left, I like lost a huge chunk of time. However, I still feel like it was something that had to be done. Like, like my therapist says part of your story. Yeah. It is part of the story. And it got me to where I am. And I’m here until obviously medications did the job that they had to do. And that part of the mental health stigma story. That’s hard for me because I was just like, so medicated, right? I don’t know, if I got pushback. I have no idea. But I’m sure like if I was posting stuff on Facebook, or I’m sure that there were things that people were like, oh, but I didn’t notice it. Yeah, yeah. So and even now I really try not to do the thing where you only post great things about yourself on social media, especially, especially now things are so hard. Moving.

It’s nuts out there. It’s It’s crazy.

Well, and that’s like where I’m struggling right now with with just where things are. Yeah. And how I’m feeling about things. And it’s giving me a lot of anxiety. Yeah. Like talking myself into coming today. I wanted to come I wanted to be here. You’re both vaccinated. I have a son with asthma. So like, that’s where we are we were vaccinated, they were going to wear masks no matter what to school, or they were going to stay at home until they could be vaccinated. Right? That’s just what we were going to have to do to take care of them. But then I have to think about it. Like, is this the right thing to do? Should I be going over there? Yeah, like, and then we would have been fine. If you said No, well, no, I know, you would have been fine with it. But the logical part of me says like, Megan, you go places with people and you sit inside with people who are vaccinated regularly. It is okay. Yeah, it’s okay to do. And even though things are changing, it’s still a lot. And I have friends who aren’t vaccinated. And I have had to say, like, we’re just not doing things with unvaccinated people inside. Okay. And that’s, that’s hard for me to do.

back. I know, I don’t want to get too much of a digression on that. But how is that gone? That conversation?

I would say probably not well, yeah. But like, I have a great group of friends. And we all have different thoughts and opinions on everything. And that’s fine. Yeah, you do,

you would take COVID out of the discussion, you would anyways,

right? And so being right, so Brian, and I just had to make a choice of what are we going to do? And how are we going to do it. So in a group text, I just said, this is what we’re doing. And this is this is kind of how it is. And I think it really made one of my friends upset. And she ended up telling me about it, and we were able to talk about it. And so it has nothing to do with how I feel about them and the choice that they are making. That’s their body, their choice, whatever. But my family can’t be inside around people who are unvaccinated at the moment. That’s what the pulmonologist told us to do for for our son’s health. Yeah. So it’s been hard. Yeah. And I feel like things aren’t normal. With a lot of a lot of people right now anyways, but I mean, that’s kind of It’s hard to have things the way that we all want them to be anyways. Yeah, so it’s hard to be a friend right now it’s hard to be a parent. Because I, I do want to respect choices everybody is making, even if I don’t agree with them, and I need to remember that I don’t agree with maybe their choice for my family, but they might not agree with my choice for their family, we’re all different. And that’s

the problem is a lot of people can’t don’t have the same attitude that you and I and then I assume have about I’m fine if you don’t get it, but these are the consequences, whatever that is, meaning maybe getting sick. Maybe passing away. I don’t know. I hate to say that. But I mean, it’s just like, I respect that you didn’t do it. But

well, I’m not going to go that far. Just because I don’t ever want to think about anybody else getting sick or dying from COVID. Because my other friend’s dad came off a ventilator, thank God, but like, there was too many people too sick. Yeah, I’m just talking about, like, right here right now. And keeping, like, just the choices we’re making with family. I don’t want to go any further because my brain can’t. So I’m like, okay, hard stop. We’re done. Yeah. But yeah, so it’s, it’s been hard to try to figure out how to be a good friend, when we’re making different choices, right?

Well, it sounds like most people have respected those kinds of things. But that’s gonna cause extra anxiety to actually even send those kinds of messages out. But again, if people people should just respect other people, and

well, it just felt like something I should say out loud, in front of like this whole group of people. Yeah. So that everybody knew up front. And that was fine. So

well, that sucks. I hate. I hate all this.

I know. So we’re just exhausted. We’re actually after

your episode, we’re actually recording a bank episode about COVID. Oh, are you? I thought about including you. But then I was like, because we, you and I kind of are on the same page, maybe a little different. But for the most part, I think we are. And but I was like, Well, two reasons. A, it’s gonna cause her a bunch of anxiety. And be, she has to represent a business and I don’t want I can even him sometimes even this last episode, he’s like, Hey, I’m feeling a little weird about something I said on the show. And I hate that. I respect it. And for him, I definitely would cut it out. He didn’t eventually thought about it. But I don’t want you have to be like home, like replaying it to your head and go, I’m like, Yeah, no, I said some things that I do want to know. So that’s why we didn’t include you. But

it’s tough all around COVID itself doesn’t give me the anxiety that it used to. That’s good. It is the the actual, like getting it. No, yeah. So that part isn’t as scary to me as it was, though. I know what can happen. But it’s the the choices that I have to make for other people. I never had that right before. Like, I’ve always made choices for my kids health. But now it just feels so much different, so much bigger,

and you’re like, you feel like you’re being judged for the choices you’re making for your family. Well,

and that’s fine with me. Because no matter what we’re going to be judged for what we’re doing, even though I’d really don’t think it’s anybody else’s opinion on what we do with our family. But you know, just making sure that we’re doing the right thing. Am I overreacting? Am I doing too much? Oh, I

see. Like, am I

am I absolutely crazy, and just going off my anxieties about keeping them safe, then I have to look back and say, No, you talked with the doctor’s office, right? You talk to them, and you’re doing what they said is good for him. And that’s okay. Yeah. And that’s just where we come from. And that’s where we sit. And, you know, if other people don’t have all the junk that we do with it, right? We don’t have the history of family members passing away, or asthma and those kinds of things, like totally

flips the script. Yeah. I mean, I don’t know why. You’ve seen Oh, god, no, I’m hard. Stop it.

Anyways, that’s where a lot of my, like, making decisions around COVID has been a big anxiety situation for me. Yeah. So, but I think that’s probably a lot of people. So I try to be open about it. And like, it’s okay, if we disagree, like, let’s just still be kind humans.

Exactly. You have to be at the end of the day. And that’s how you get through things. So speaking of stuff that can be overwhelming, whether it’s COVID or otherwise, or a conversation with your husband that doesn’t go as well as maybe you wanted it to, or kids are being kids and making poor decisions. I’ll be honest, one of the things I really struggle with in life is when stuff like that happens, especially if it comes in like twos or threes and things are just not great. I have a tendency to just kind of shut down and pull away and Be short with people. Curious. Yeah, right? What does that look like for you? How do you deal with those days that are just so overwhelming? What gets you through? noise cancelling

headphones? night? Number one? Yeah, yes. And what I was talking earlier about kind of full circle with ADHD and getting back to figuring out what exactly this does being overwhelmed sensitivity to sounds that I didn’t know was a thing. And just kind of learning more about myself. I’m like, okay, there’s so much going on. And like, I just need to just take, take a step back. And Brian will even say, like, put your headphones in. So like, I’ll pop them in, and then everybody else is gone. And I can do what I need to do. But like hearing different devices in different rooms, and everybody is happy, everybody’s doing nothing going on, nothing going on. But it’s all so much to me. And it happens regularly. So like, taking noise out of the out of the stimulus. Yes, like just taking that out is very helpful to me. And that is that happens more often than I would like it to first thing in the morning, it could happen when the kids are up and like running around getting ready for school just too much for me. Or like as soon as I walk in the door, when I walk in after work, because they have been home for a while. And Brian probably was working until Well, I mean, he has to work until at least 430. So yeah, you know, then all of a sudden everybody needs everything. Yeah, they’ve been home.

Yeah. Has it been home for an hour on their own? And then you come home? Like,

yeah, explosions. So the the sound thing is hard for me. And that doesn’t. That just is kind of the that will make me erupt, like, I’ll be done for the entire day. But as far as just feeling overwhelmed with other stuff, I think that talking with my friends about it is a very good place to go. One of my friends sent me a text and she was like, Hey, I know that you have a lot going on. And you were at this bachelorette party with her over the weekend. And that and she goes, but like are we cool? Are we okay? Oh, and I was so thankful that she asked me that. And I was like, Yeah, like this whole mask thing, no mask thing at school and like kind of how like it has divided a lot of people has been a lot for me, and I’ve just kind of stayed off my phone. I just haven’t been talking as much to other people. And she cared enough to be like, hey, like, Are we okay, like what’s happening? And I really appreciated that. She did that for me. Because I guess I do kind of close down, which is not something I would have thought that I did. But just even if I only talk to people in text conversations, by not reaching out and talking with people, I guess is a way that I am shutting down.

Yeah, texting is not the same as it I appreciate when people check in via text, but it’s not the same. Like we’re having a conversation face to face. Like we go back to the therapy, the energy around it, isn’t there? Did you find going back to the noise thing? Have you found that through therapy, this is something that you’ve you realize like cuz you know, we all are trying to find our quote unquote, triggers where I am to physically or environmentally that before I lose it, you know what I mean? Like, what’s happening to my body? Is that something that you worked on? And that’s why you’re like, Oh, this is really been helpful, or you just

know, I just noticed, oh, you just know, yeah, so and but I’m able to look at Brian now and say, Hey, I’m gonna lose my shit. You know, I really need you to take this, that’s you have to communicate that we usually don’t say it nicely, because I usually wait too long. So I’m going to take him, I’ll be fine. I’m going to be fine. It’s going to be fine. No big deal. And then I’m like, I lose it. So could you just please help me? And it works out and everything who’s like put your headphones in? It’s fine

with me. You’ll get to the point. And I hope I do too. Mads have have helped, yeah, that you not right to the brink that you’re like 10 seconds before that. And then 30 seconds, and then like, five minutes, you’re like, Oh, I see this coming. But that’s really cool that you were able to verbalize that with

one when my friend called we actually FaceTime each other a lot in the through COVID. Even like when she was working or like I’m at home, getting stuff done or working from home, we would just sit on FaceTime with each other. We didn’t even have to talk to each other. We were just there. Yeah, you just had somebody there. And every once in a while, like you say something so you just do your chores, but it would just be on Yeah, like in the kitchen in my ear. Yeah. Oh, wow. So like we hadn’t done that in like a week. And she’s like, Hey, what’s up? Are you okay? week? Yeah. Right. Like it’s it’s weird that that kind of had become our standard thing. That’s kind of how we were able to struggle through a lot of the COVID crash was together, together apart. Yeah. So using

Yeah, I don’t think I want to hear Ben for hours on end on FaceTime.

I know I’d be so boring because I don’t say anything. Yeah, you sit in the dark. Sometimes

we’ll see. But Ben might not be the right person because of Ben’s not gonna say anything ever. And he wants to be alone. Yeah, whereas I really enjoy being with other people. Yeah, yeah, that makes so and she’s like that, too, then? Probably not as much as I am. Yeah, but

well, nobody’s I say that with love

  1. I know. All right.

So with the COVID, we’ve had on quite a bit we’ve hit on the mental health piece. Usually there’s some interplay when you bring in the face card. Now, I don’t know what it’s like for your family. But I imagine with you being one who needs connection and that sort of thing, what role did church or faith or all of that play? In the midst of the COVID craziness and the craziness of dealing with your mental health?

You assume that she goes to church and as a Christian? I mean,

I’ve seen her posts like,

well, I’m definitely a Christian. We didn’t go to church. We have not gone back to church. Yeah. Okay. And the place that we were going,

Oh, yeah, you and I had a conversation about this. Yes, I don’t, don’t say if you don’t want to,

they went back without masks. And that was that was what it was. But that means that we didn’t go back right. Um, however, there was a space for people with masks it just it but that felt like a whole weird situation like

the leper colony or something, you over there with a mask.

Either got to do one or the other.

I mean, I never went to I’m not gonna say like, if it was good or bad, I can’t judge it. But we were also going through a lot of other stuff at the exact same time. So we didn’t go I would live stream every now and then probably not enough. But, you know, at the same No, energy. It’s not the same to watch church online. It’s just not so we haven’t gotten to a place where we feel like church hunting because that is overwhelming. It is overwhelming to find new churches. I’ve talked to Jason a few times. Yeah, about his church. And I’m like, you know, what’s, what’s going on there. And I think that it would be fine. If we went back to the other place, and wore masks. However, that kind of puts us in that whole other space of like being in places with unvaccinated, right? Well, we’re where our family is not sitting currently. So it’s not great. Things are great. Oh, hard spiritually,

just for an example for our church. So we lean, I shouldn’t say we. it leans left. And again, I’m bringing up politics with religion, which is the bane of Ben’s existence, and, but it’s just the reality of it. You know what I mean? It feels especially that way right now. Yeah, yeah. So we were hyper focused on the masks. Everything in our numbers were Ting Ting Ting, money Ting Ting is going down, right. So it’s, it was rough. I mean, it’s still as rough. So I actually went to church today for production. We’ve only been one time and that was when the numbers were like, zilch. I mean, you remember when they were like less than 1%? Grand Rapids. I’m like, all right, baby. We’re back. You know what I mean, and didn’t last long. So I think we went twice as a family. So I was going to production today. And I was wondering, I actually went to the website and I was like, what’s going on with masks? Like I didn’t even know I actually had one in my pocket. Yeah, walk in. Not a soul with a mask on. And it surprised me because they have been so hyper focus on safety. I think they’re worried about losing more people. Yeah, they’re not going to implement it again. I don’t think they’re gonna

Did you feel like you should wear a mask and that’s why you brought it

so here’s my stand on the mask. Now I did get COVID right from not wearing probably not wearing a mask in Nashville. But I look at the mask is if it’s not if it’s if the place that I’m going is not asking me to wear one. I’m not gonna wear one. Okay. And but I should have a Nashville now. They were as they were suggesting, was not a law. It was not a mandate. It was not any of it. I should have. And I actually, I pride myself on an FSU. I don’t care what you think. But I actually fell into some peer pressure in Nashville. The partner the guy went with, didn’t wear a mask. didn’t ask me to we didn’t even talk about it. But if he would have put a mask on, I would have, but he didn’t. So I did it. But why didn’t I that is if I was around 1000s of people. I mean, we were in huge, huge conference rooms and sitting close to each other. Oh, yeah. And you didn’t get COVID by the way, we sat next to each other every class we went to. We stayed in the same Airbnb. We ate the same meals together. He didn’t get it. So my point is with the mask, I brought it with me because if if that was the rule and we were all doing masks again a bit okay I’ll do a mask it doesn’t really bother me right yeah but I’m sad that the church I know they’re not doing it because they’re worried about numbers so now they’re being influenced by money yeah, my attendance attendance and there was I mean I saw maybe one mask and

the reason I asked you that is because Ben captures in his pocket last week so yes or whenever that was yeah when he was going with his family Yes, Yes, I did. That’s why I asked what if he why you even brought it Yeah,

because I didn’t want i mean again, if everyone or three quarters of the people were in masks I would have thrown a mask on but I walked in and again the worship leader very very focused on COVID she was not messed up so I was basing it kinda on that and then I feel bad cuz I’m like, man I probably should this is a big place with a lot of people I don’t know I feel guilty now.

I feel guilty you’re vaccinated and they say that’s what you’re Yeah, it’s

different now. Delta says a few about the vaccine you know what I mean? I was vaccinated I got it

yep. See it’s this is why my brain is like

well exactly yeah. And I think a lot of my anxiety no we’re totally getting off board but just to wrap this part up is the internet the internet should be deleted right now can we delete it for six months

but you still have Tic Tac can’t and podcast no love

your Oh I know I did

we need a reset I mean

we need a reset we need like a six month like caught the internet offer six months we’re all going to come back and we’re going to try again.

I think the world be would be a much better place if everybody just turned off their internet for a day let’s just do a day I mean that would be revolutionary though.


I’m just deleting Facebook off my phone right now. Like there’s

you know i i did it for about early COVID I did it for about six or eight months and just went to the browser when I like so it was work right like I had to like log in and all that shit it went so far down like a track my time it was like almost nothing

well what date is it today so 29th we’ll see how far we get

no, I use it on the desktop. Yes. Oh, I was working on podcasts like the only reason I keep Facebook honestly is for the podcast brands because people listen on most our communities on facebook i mean if you look the last time I actually posted an actual without sharing threads or whatever it’s probably been nothing you don’t have because I just don’t do it anymore.

I like Facebook and like I didn’t do baby books for my kids so I can’t get rid of it.

You know you’re right the memories are incredible. Oh yeah that’s from yeah oh you’re right. Can’t get rid of them. Yeah, true. Anyways, so back to your your church you haven’t quite fit you haven’t gone back yet. You don’t know if you’re gonna go back to church, but it’s incredibly hard to hunt for churches right now because of COVID it’s hard without COVID

and it feels like there’s just just so much work to find a church right? So I can go off things people say and then hope for the best but I don’t know that we’re in a place that we want to show up to a church right now. Anyways, Master unmasked, just take just take that part out of the equation of Yup, they are requiring.

I mean, you almost have to send an email be like Hey, so again, back to the the mass thing like where do you stand on this? No, okay, cool. I’m out. Or Okay, cool. I’m in like,

and you know, it should be such a big priority. It feels like it should be one of my top priorities is to find like, you know, our faith said like, find the home that we should be at that we go meet our people. Yeah. And that just feels so damn overwhelming. Yeah, it’s one thing Yeah, like, and I just can’t do it right now. Yeah, there’s nothing wrong with that. So and that’s that makes me sad. Like, I’m guilty. Yeah, like I’m almost gonna cry right now. I feel really sad about that. But at the same time, I can’t put anything else on my plate. No. So you got to do what you got to do. Yeah, so we’ll just keep listening to praise and worship at home. Just try to keep our kids in a good spot and you know, explain the things that we need to explain to them you know, keep them on the right path. And we’ll get there it’s just not it’s just not right now.

Yeah, it’s tough. I I struggle with my faith. I connect when I go to church, I’m stronger my faith, which is da alright. Yes. That’s why we go right. Yeah, to kind of reset and re energize with that. And yeah, it’s, it’s been a real a real struggle for me, too. So what do you think?

And Ben goes twice a day. So yeah,

it’s us. I don’t recommend that.

Remember, back in the day,

did you know we had fun while you guys are going to church twice a day. Oh, it was

probably talked about this. My gosh it was like morning and night we couldn’t mow the lawn we couldn’t go to Meijer we couldn’t do any of that stuff

listen we went to church and then we came home and we would mow the lawn and we would play outside

and Cody’s muster like blown a gasket

they you know there were some Protestant reformed people behind us

Oh good sports.

Yes them which I’m one of their kids recently it’s super nice. Oh really? Yeah, that’s the way most of them turned out good. I don’t know the different family but but like so we were the ones that mowed the lawn in the neighborhood we were Lutherans and then you know we had Krishna reform row like everywhere around us so we would be playing outside and it was not weird to look over at a friend’s house and see people looking out the window like while you’re playing

now as I got older that that those rules loosened in our home and I think my dad even started mowing the lawn on on Sundays at didn’t in a pinch like if we had a busy weekend or whatever busy week he couldn’t get it done but yeah, which is hilarious By the way, like, we live this strict life and meanwhile it’s a shit show in the background. Yeah.

But I was like, Whoa, what is happening in your family?

shitty Well, yeah. Especially with the the revelations or Yeah, revelations that we’ve had in the last, you know, year, how much crazy stuff was going on. But that’s for a different day. But well, Megan, thank you so much for, for coming on. And I just love talking to you. I know we were going to get together this year, and then the numbers started creeping up again and you never texted me back like a jerk. So No, I’m just kidding.

I’m terrible at that. If I don’t answer right away then it’s not funny. She’s like, Hey,

you got you want to go to the pool? You guys do the membership at Sunnybrook? She’s like, is that a youth thing? Or mega thing? So I’ll leave it. I mean, I never responded back. That’s not my fault. But yeah, it’s normally me. I’m the scheduler of the family. But yeah, we do need to, once this stuff is all over with, hang out. Absolutely. So But no, this has been fun. Maybe we just need to interview our friends on our show to get them over like that, right? Yeah.

Thank you. Good idea. All right. Well, thank you for listening to another episode of threads, podcast life unfiltered. We challenge you to keep the faith do your work and dare to be uncomfortable. Thanks for listening.

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