Transcription #139

Hi guys welcome to threads podcast life unfiltered Episode 139 thank you so much for joining us tonight when we’re recording but you could be listening to it in the morning or in the middle of the night or whenever we appreciate any time that you’ve listened reds podcast tonight no beds So tonight we’re going to talk show ban and use the voice you hear of course you’ve heard before is Mr. Michael van Drea from Holland long ways away, he packed a lunch but before we get into the topic, which is the personal format because it just fits better with two of us that don’t record all the time and it’s always good to catch up on Mike and those kinds of things. But before we get into that Mike is going to do the intro to threads tonight and then introduce an icebreaker. Okay,

well threads is about unfiltered conversations real conversations that is our hope and joy here even tonight. There are three main buckets or categories that is faith mental health and uncomfortable conversation. Conversations not one conversation but

conversations conversations. Megan says I say zation drives her nuts kind

of feels like it should be yes because we’re Dutch and or have German German and Dutch area there we go. Anyways, tonight’s direction is a personal format but with a twist we have a twist for this one but you’re gonna have to stay tuned for that because we’re not going to tell you that right now. So So Jason

radio DJ 101 point five Stay tuned for the cliffhanger That’s awesome.

Anyways, how are you showing up tonight as we enter into this time of digging deep into unfiltered conversations

I’m pretty good I yesterday was a rest day as you know Mike and I are which is crazy for you. Yes, I went 11 days in a row. I want to make sure I beat Mike for July honestly most of that 11 days in a row is like I gotta put him in the box. Yeah, and I’m like I cannot lose for the third month in a row. And as you know if you’ve listened to podcasts whoop we use this in it we’re in it’s a competition and these boys are big boys you’re trimming down of course Ben is too but I literally have to do two workouts a day to get what they get if I want to win and so I was like screw and Mike’s sleeping on the couch I’m gonna be running for bed sleep and I’m gonna be biking or I’m gonna be at the gym or whatever so yeah 11 days in a row had a rest day yesterday that was really good and went out did my quote unquote long run which is four miles and it was good it was I did do guided for we use Mike and I use the Nike run club. I like the guided I think I do it because I want to stay what they’re saying because when it gets eight or nine miles though they better give me some rock out Yeah,

something better. I mean I do like them or or do you want more quiet? Is that what you’re wanting? Well, I want

my own music. Yeah, you know what I mean? Like when you’re kind of rocking out and they’re like, okay, we’ll be back in 1k I’m like 1k like how about in 20 minutes come back.

See it’s different for me that that 1k takes forever so I’m like it’s fine for me. You know

and that being said, I do want to mention I am super proud of you and I know you’re proud of yourself but is it weird when someone tells you they’re proud of you? Yeah, it is kind of weird I know you don’t take it very well I’ve said that to you before on telegram and you don’t respond oh that’s gonna keep that out. Like eff you like I literally am because I know where you’ve come from. Yep. And I mean used to hate running Yep. And I was actually surprised how like you didn’t want to go out yesterday

did not at all to start because you because you waited too long. I waited too long and I was comfortable and it was hot as heck outside yesterday was terrible sweated everything away

yeah that’s why I took yesterday off but so yeah, I’m coming in good sited to record tonight as always How about you?

I’m coming in great had a great night last night had that good run after I drink a lot of water and took a long nap

was your nap longer than my no but like cheese because I took a two and a half hour

no because our which which is a good length nap I was just out of it after running that and then there was a worship night last night that I went to was able to speak for like a short five minutes there. There’s somebody who decided to get baptized cool um, last night so it was a great night church was good. took a nap today again, so I’m coming into Ray Ida a to nap weekend This is why Jason’s gonna win July because I took it and a half on Sunday instead of working out so but yeah, anyways, I am coming in good ready to dig in.

Well, your Sunday’s are rest days anyways, you’ve always said that. Yeah. And I wasn’t planning on a rest day. I was going to Run yesterday and biked today. But after my workout on Friday, I was just like, you know what my legs are I can I was feeling pain and not soreness. I’ve been having a little bit of a little bit of Shin splint pain in my right leg.

Oh, I better start ice on that. But I do okay, after my runs, I

throw some ice on there. But yeah, so let’s, let’s talk about, you know, what’s going on what connections what interactions and then we’ll kind of Oh, by the way, we are going to talk about Episode Five of threads. So go back and listen to that. You’ll if you don’t like mouth noises, please take some exam and anti anxiety medication. That was bad. That was rough before you listen. But yeah. So I had a connection with Stephanie from grow hub. gr so what is girl hub? gR it’s a it’s an organization that, I mean, it’s a business but they try to connect people with the community. They just bought office space, and they’re renting it out and those kinds of things. And we’re connecting with them to be their podcast guru. Awesome. They created a little studio space. I was there last week definitely needs some work. For sounds. It’s very it’s in like the 100 year old building. So the ceilings are incredibly high. So like, Hey, get some insulation here. drywall this off. You need some sound panels like we have in here. But yeah, we’re going to be helping them get people started on podcasting. And it was just really cool. Stephanie is amazing. She is so positive. And I’m always you know, me, like I always got my like, I’m suspicious. Yeah, suspicious, but she’s just amazing. And it was just a really, it was a good time. Yeah. And I’m excited that we could grow this business and maybe I, I mean, my dream. And she heard that and she was googoo. gaga over that. She’s the big dreamer. And okay, partners like okay, Steph. Let’s bring it down on the budget. Yep. budgets. Her friend. Our partner Nikki is yes, PR. Yes. was like okay, Jason. Calm down. Let’s look at the budget. That’s a nice shot. So yeah, I’m really excited for that. My dream is to grow this podcast production company, or any of the podcasts into a full time thing. And it’s getting there. It’s slowly chunking along that Oh,

well. That’s awesome. It sounds like a great connection and fun time.

Yeah. Let’s talk about the bonfire. We both put that Yeah. meaningful interaction.

Yeah. So in Ben, if you listen, he will listen. Are you kidding me? So So Ben, when you listen like so we went out to eat with your wife and my wife and I was full and all that, and I was like, man, a bonfire and I’m like, I just want to go home. But once we got there was a great time. Yes. Awesome time hanging out with guys and meeting new guys. There’s conversation that was going well past midnight, and we could have probably gotten told to and I’m glad we didn’t because I would have like, not made it the night you would have had to

stay in our spare bedroom. Yeah, like I’m asleep in the next six hours here. And then I’m going home

because it was but it was it was great conversation. Great guys. Just talking like real, real stuff. It wasn’t like, fake like, sometimes you go to fires, and she’s all fake talk. And people were getting real. Like you guys talked about, like therapists and different things. Yeah. And I was like,

This is cool. Well, I knew everyone there except Joe Reed, where we did interview him, but I didn’t know him. Yeah, as much. So I was pretty sure that we were all going to be comfortable, be authentic. Here’s a little digression for you. So Megan said to me, she just said this today. And, you know, it’s just funny. She’s like, what do you think about you and Mike and Ben going up to the cabin for a long weekend? I was like, no,

it could turn out. It could be really good or look at me like

she was she was taken aback by that. I was like, you know, because when you go up there, there’s responsibilities, right? Yeah. So someone’s got to cook. Someone’s got to do the dishes. I feel more quote unquote, and coach responsible because it’s, you know, my mother in law’s cabins around in the boat. You know, I know you guys aren’t wild, guys, but yeah, totally. Yeah. Yeah, you got so ship face at the bonfire. Oh, wait, no, no, that was me. I think it’s shifted. I was hung over the next day, but not too bad. But uh, so no, I don’t know if I could spend three solid days and it’s I mean, you can do your own thing you die hacking or whatever, but I don’t want you to feel offended me saying that. I’m not saying I won’t do it. But it’d be tough. What would it be tough about it?

I think cuz we all we all live so differently. I think three days in the sound like you’re camping in a tent where it’s like no one’s like place it’s your place that you’re used to right? And Ben and I could treat it different or like some you know, even the times we go to better so randomly different. Yeah, I imagine I just been a weird time but

it’d be Yeah, I mean, we would all have our own sleeping space, so that would be fine. Yeah. I wanted to go to bed at night and you and Ben wanted to stay up and talk till 2am at the fire I mean yeah I would have no problem with that but but what I said is the bonfire was like that perfect amount of time Cardinal hours have a few beers. You know, I definitely want to do that again. I can’t say I want to say the whole week. Oh, the whole weekend. Sorry. I was looking at the rundown. Like Did you did you read my brain about this? But going back to our little double date as everyone knows, or if you’re new listener Mike and I do in tough mudder in like 20 days August 15. And so we kind of like hey, we need to go out together and see if you know Megan and Natalie won’t stab each other in the throat

otherwise it’d be the longest race ever for them to be next to each other.

I know because we’ll probably be out there for hours

or hours Yeah, I guess based on based on how fast I can run for miles Yeah, I think we’re gonna be out there good for hours

Yeah, you got to remember though the running is not the running is going to be perfect for your pain perfect. Yeah, because I won’t want to do anything harder. Yeah, because you’ll be exhausted but so we went to if I saying it right, Tupelo honey.

Sure your sounds great to me.

Thank you. Thank you very much. So yeah, Tupelo honey. We had been there before and it was okay. And the chicken to me seemed a little dry. Did you feel that too cuz you just got just the the honey yeah the thing is like they put honey on a lot of stuff. Yep. Did you feel the same thing?

Yeah, it was a little bit dry and the portions weren’t huge but now as of now to be fair, they actually probably use normal real chickens and that like yes like KFC chickens which are like overly grown and like they fall over but it was decent food like the the the taste was great the tastes are I think they just don’t they overcook it or if they don’t add enough moisture before I don’t know whatever

Yeah, I don’t know how they must bake it in the morning and then that it must sit and then run it through the warmer again which I totally get I’m not expecting them to batter it and you know make it right there but I got the one with the siracha sauce on it was dope so how did you think that interaction went with all four of us?

I think it went good.

It was a good time even though Megan still insists that she doesn’t remember me back from wild that go well i mean that’s the reality the lady doesn’t lie man like if she doesn’t remember you She doesn’t remember you like I know which is fair you know off topic not really she had a rough time at the end of that so she had her blinders on like get me the hell out of here because there was some

crap and I was new and I was like okay, this person you know some

and she’s not she’s what am I trying to say? She’s you can spot her easily she has curly hair and red and it’s big and so

and I’ve also like I think physically I probably changed the most Yeah, I was I was 200 pounds and now I’m 300 pounds cannot imagine 200 pounds I was skinny it could be I don’t have a beard like I look radically different so so it actually be interesting for me to find a photo from back then yeah,

I will I won’t do that

after after send it to

you. Are you like with the beard because yours is yours pretty getting there I mean probably keep it trimmed as you know you don’t want people to think you’re like me like a homeless guy but are you I know are really digressing but that’s okay. Would you ever shave that beard now?

No The reason why is that this is so vain ready for this my my my chin is extra skinny yeah and now that like I have a beard you can’t tell that it looks like I have a nice a wide chin Yeah, you

look like you could take a punch but if

I would shave it it’s just like this like it’s not quite a point but it’s not a wide chin and I you know like at this point you know and I like the beard I like that it looks good on you covers up the double chin and everything so I don’t think I’d shave it unless somebody gave me good money yeah I read of it

I don’t know if you’re going to show me that picture when you’re I’ll find it

I’ll find it for you

cool So long story short the bonfires cool Ben we’d love to have another one. I will entertain a weekend up at the cabin I’m kind of rethinking that now because sounded like kind of a dick thing to say

it doesn’t sound like a jerk thing for me but maybe I’m just a jerk to you and I kind of you are kind of well you

know as far as speaking of that the the meetup with Natalie and you I was worried because I was like You better not be like you bend to me cuz I was like, we’re gonna have a problem like so. Yes, full transparency. Megan hated that about my friends. Okay, because they couldn’t, they would constantly I did it too. And that’s kind of why we grew apart and I got a buddy His name’s Eugene and I do love them we talked about on the podcast for his best man at my wedding. He messaged me the other day and he was just like, calling me names and stuff like I’m like, dude, we haven’t talked in like too much. Yeah, I’m not expecting to rub my back and like hold my hand and tell me but I’m going right. hard in the paint right away. For sure. So thank you for not doing that.

Oh, for sure. Like I know, I know you’re worried but That’s that’s just like my extra fun side and then Meghan Gatlin my boring side you know boring serious about real life No but but to be fair that we we both got into some deep stuff and I think that helps it not be all guy jokes the whole time.

You mean the conversation?

Yeah there’s some deep calm Yeah,

I really liked Natalie. I can’t I don’t I don’t have her figured out yet because that was you know, we were together for like two hours. Yeah, but yeah, i i’d like the vibe. I think everyone was vibing Yeah. And she had said something to Megan, some girl talk to Megan. She told me and I thought well, that’s Yeah, that’s cool for me like,

this is she can hang Yeah, the other thing that’s hard is she, she’s a little bit more like bandwidth hearing. She’s not gonna like that. I said that so rooms that are loud. She has a hard time picking it up the voices across Gosh,

yeah, I knew I told you when to know and I forgot how I mean, she would she would not have heard a thing from you guys. ratably low as she had looked into hearing aids. Is that like a pride thing for her like,

yeah, I’m not gonna Yeah, that’s like discussion. Well, I’m

just saying I know we tease Ben about it because dude, his life like he has that tinnitus or what? Yeah, that ringing his ear. He’s like, it’s been a game changer for me. And plus, he can play all his telegram messages through his hearing aid,

which I was telling Natalie. I was like, if someday when you get there when you’re there, you know, that’s one benefit is you don’t need an air pad or anything like that. You just have your hearing aids and that works and for that, but anyway, so we have awesomely digress, dude,

that’s all right. Let’s talk a little bit. You know, when we discussed about the personal update, it’s kind of like a valley or a shitty time or whatever. And yeah, I I put this on here, but apparently you have more to digress about it.

I don’t know, I just have a feeling like let’s let’s, let’s hash it out a little bit for people.

Okay. And I think people are going to get a feel of theme, a theme of I’m kind of a dick when it comes to like working out. And I’m competitive and and that’s kind of what’s going on, but I had done a run and so for those running you you know, you follow a program right? And I’ve ran many half marathons and those kind of things and I’ve never really done like the slow recovery runs, those kind of things. Like I’ve just if it was a four miler, I just did the four mile or if I felt great, I might have pushed it if I felt shitty. I back off. didn’t really care. Yep. All I cared about was what time I want to hit the half marathon. Yep. And so these runs through Nike run club. They’re so focused on like recovery when you run those. Yep. And I ran out and did a 35 minute recovery run. And I was like, I feel like shit. I did. I felt like shit and it’s hard for me to put it in perspective for me to hit 11 minute miles is incredibly slow. Yeah, I mean, it’s like I have to watch my watch and be like, Okay, back off back off. And so I showed Mike my my heart rate and he’s like, bro, I’ve researched this like you’re you’re way too high and your heart rate that is not a recovery, right? No wonder you felt like shit and that’s, he texted that, but in my head that was the tone. I was hearing it. Yeah, I got pissed and I like ghosted him for a whole day.

Yep, totally and

Mike he writes he wrote in the rundown I know I’m a no at all. And I know I said something to like okay Google athlete or something like you’re a Google App

yes that that is what you said did that bother you? No, not at all. Now

I don’t know what is my problem?

I don’t know and here’s the thing like like perspective oh yeah I am and so I get obsessed about things is you have found out so like I don’t just say hey, I’m going to start running I’m also a big guy running so I’m like I have to figure out how to run smarter so like Ashley for you yeah so I’m like researching it with I’m not just using the app I’m like trying to you know go gone different website just put the bed there sorry about you’re not even here go to different websites podcasts like okay, how am I going to best build my cardio base because I need to and they talked about the you know the 8020 you know 80% needs to be you know, lower heart rate especially recovery so when you said you know I feel like shit and then you show me I’m like well that’s why you feel like shit and I was trying to help you now looking back see that’s the problem with text it is we almost should ban texting. Well man

did ban texting if we’re upset with each Yeah. Then so going back to that recovery run the day before I did a speed workout like so. And in you also bite there and back. I did but it was a slow it was I didn’t do anything. Yeah. So yeah, so I should have ran slower. And that’s what’s weird about the Nike run club. They’re super focused on recovery. Yeah, the speed runs are ridiculous. Like, as I told him, like, I would not do those. I’m yeah, you’re smart. You’re looking you’re gonna do them and I was like, man, my legs are feeling it. I mean I the day before I did, like my pace was like seven minute miles Yeah, I was like, yeah. Dying so then I go a recovery run and that’s why I was shitty so it just frustrated me because I always and I don’t you know you work in a white collar job and so maybe this isn’t a thing but I equate it to you start at a you’re at a job right? I’m at my job. We hire somebody new, let’s say which we won’t because no one leaves there. And this guy starts telling me what to do. Oh, for sure. Or saying he knows better. I’m like, Listen, bro. Yep, I’ve been doing this for 20 years I’ve been in this company for 12 years. Yep, I know everything. No, I don’t know everything. I know most everything there is to know so I kind of equate that to running because you’ve never run half marathons. You never have done anything like that. And I’ve done a bunch of them. Yeah, it was a decade ago. Yeah, but I know what I’m doing. Yeah, clearly. That run I didn’t know what I was.

So I was trying to be helpful but it probably came off as a no at all. And that But anyways, we worked through it after after you’re done. Go Steen. Yeah, but you know I was proud of you though for taking that beat though. Not just like being the complete donkey. That’s that’s what I brought him back.

That’s what I’m working towards. And what I should have said to you, as I should have said, Hey, I’m taking a break. Yep. And so I didn’t because I’m sure you were wondering why and like you had messaged a couple times, and I didn’t respond. And like that’s figured out pretty quickly. That’s kind of a dick move. I should have said hey, I need some time. Yeah. And that’s I’m trying to do because I wanted to say something. None of it was it none of it was nice. Yeah. But I mean, yeah, I was like, what the mistake again? Like, what am I doing? Like, I need to be a grown up and just Yeah, and I will I will say to I’ve never trained with anyone. Yeah, I’ve always trained by myself and we haven’t run together but we’re constantly back and forth, back and forth. So I’m glad we worked it out.

Because otherwise this wouldn’t have happened.

Well yeah, I told Mike I said we’ll talk about on the podcast he wouldn’t do it. He goes oh, we need to talk about it before we can we can you know talk about the aftermath. But I don’t know I like to Were you worried that I was gonna like sabotage you

know, I just don’t think a podcast is the place to like work out a friendship like I think there’s friendship deepening but I don’t feel like that’s like where you solve your problems and that’s a whole other day to like not yeah solver French and it wasn’t worth again, it wasn’t worth the time. More than what I gave and I should have like, Hey, I just need to be in I don’t know. Totally worked.

I tried to look at these situations and saying Yeah, not the silver lining. Well, kind of I guess like this is what I did wrong. Because it was wrong. I overreacted but this is what I did. Right? Yep. You know, and you only can learn from Yep, you know the mistakes butcher

his name, I would say more drama than seventh grade girls. But you know what? That’s because we’re all competitive.

You know, it’s funny. We are but Ben’s a ninja competitor. Oh, that pisses me off so much

Ben for the last like seven days of July is gonna get like scores of 24 seven days Yeah, you know, he’s gonna

come back from Oregon. And he’s like, Hey man, it was good and then all of a sudden it’s gonna be like 19th because he wrote a bike 15 miles or something ass real quick today what I learned I love this on I’ve been trying to talk about this a little more I really liked this on Reddit and a you can actually which I didn’t know I found out today you can search the subreddit and then search what you’re looking for Really? So I searched today I learned and then mental health oh nice and a bunch of stuff popped up so I was like, perfect. So this was again take all this with a grain of salt This is Reddit so don’t you can fact check me I’m not saying it’s true or false but today I learned heavyweight boxing champion Tyson fury which is he’s super popular right now. Okay struggled with drug addiction and mental health issues for years when is first fought when he first fought Deontay Wilder in 2018 for he donated his entire $9 million purse from the fight to charities that specialize in providing housing for recovering alcoholics and addicts. Wow. Nine

and is in his whole purse like everything he earned from a fight

Yeah, no clearly he up until that fight. He was making some good money. I mean, yeah, he’s he’s top of his game right now, but I’m like, wow. And then someone Someone commented Tyson was born premature at only one pound dude grew into a six foot nine monster.

Wait, he’s six foot nine. Oh, yeah. He’s huge. He is. Yeah, I

bet he’s,

I bet he’s like 280 pounds. So like him versus versus like, like Mike Tyson.

Yeah, Mike is way short. Yeah. And stockier. Yeah, but you know, but six foot nine and Mike’s like six one. Okay.

That’s crazy.

I know. Can you believe that? So I thought that was I thought that was really cool. So that is cool. We are going to jump into our recap. So Episode Five we’re trying to do these on the personal episodes just because I don’t want to do it every time listen to my shitty show every week and I hope you enjoy them and we encourage you to go back and listen to them and then see like not just the audio quality but just see the fact of you know us growing as people and those kinds of things. I think the next one after this is a wives one I don’t know who I am. We’re gonna recap Yeah, you need to you have to Okay, I think a couple of times we did it all together and then for a while we switched it off and I yeah, so we’ll have to see. But uh, do you want to talk a little bit word wise about anything? Or

I’m just again I feel like I say this every time just like personal growth of YouTube like even like there are some things in there that I’m like I don’t know Jason was fully telling the truth not that you were like you especially with family Yeah, I’m gonna bring that okay wrote Okay, stuff that was like, I’m not sure maybe it was different than but like, that’s not you at all knows, like, I think you’ve just gotten really honest. And then you were kind of you were trying to be honest, but like, you didn’t want to bring that all up right away. You know, I

think early on, I was worried. I was worried they were gonna listen to it. So a couple of things I wrote down my sister was in town I said it was awesome. Yeah, I mean, it it was that moment I talked about how seeing how well their kids had acclimated and to people that don’t know my sister has two and a half autistic kids. four kids one of them’s like, I don’t know but okay, they don’t know he’s got sensory issues, but they were just great. And that was true, but it wasn’t awesome to spend time like every time I go into that situation it’s it’s five alarm fire, so that was kind of crappy. Or it’s lots of mouth noises and awkward intro was a rough start. It was the weirdest

Why Why did you guys start like that? Do you know? Okay,

I think that was the first one that our intro song made it though, right? Or the other one?

I think one of them before did but yeah, definitely had the intro song. It went way too long. eventual song was like 30 seconds. Yeah, I

turn that way down. I try to like fade it in when Ben starting to talk about threads. Yeah, I noticed that I was fussy about going to church again. And clearly that’s a theme with me and I seriously like I sat in church today. And I was like what am I doing? Yeah, I’m like, I want to be here. I want to worship God I love the environment. I love my my pastor pastor Terry. I love everything about it. Why am I having so much trouble either getting here or just in general? Yeah. Tell me

Is that something that you’ve talked to with your therapist yet about to dig into that or is that not been your focus?

I have not and that’s a good idea and we’ll talk about mental health a little bit I’m not focused on myself well I mean in theory I am I guess but so yeah, I’m clearly that’s been a theme off and on since we started

threat Yep, definitely heard that and I was like, man, I almost picked some clips of that I was like no I’m gonna stay away from that what I love Jason pick that up at BYU

I didn’t pick any clips I just your yours were great. I appreciate you doing that I pick I’m gonna use three out of the four not the baseball ones. So yeah, and then I noticed Ben and math and birthdays is a stretch I mean still today. I mean, you heard like two episodes ago for the last six months I’ve been telling people I’m 46 I’m 45 so clearly you know we talked about on the gig economy podcast we don’t do math or geography like those things do not quote us on that Yeah. And so yeah, let’s let’s listen to a few clips and kind of discuss them I’m just saying why is it that I am so nervous my daughter tonight went around the block on her bike Oh, freaking out in my head I let her go Yeah, wow, I don’t trust anyone but when I was a kid be back when the when the street lights go on. I mean we’d play football we’d be running around the neighborhood not causing trouble just being being kids being kids come back all sweaty and like take a bath and go to bed. Yeah. I can’t let my kids do that. I just and I feel like it’s and we’ve gone talked about this for as the media I see all the crimes all the terrible things I mean, they just arrested the illegal immigrant for a murder out in Iowa this young girl dragging in this population of 1400 and he killed her you know what I mean? And I get it it’s it happens all the time. But we see it now all the time where we didn’t before and maybe maybe I’m too worried and I should let go a little bit. Yeah. All right. Why did you pull that one?

So she was 10 right? Yes, tannish is interesting so like, I’m having that struggle this year with cam of like letting him go farther and farther. Well, okay, you can go to this park with friends. You can go over here, right and he doesn’t have a phone. So but somebody in the group what’s so interesting That was like we’re all worried and but us as kids right we could do more it was more dangerous for us to go out and be without parents than it is now you think so it like stats will show like there’s much more a higher chance and people can fact check that and if I’m wrong tell me I’m wrong but usually are but but the stats I found though are like to be kidnapped is way less chance than it was when we were kids in the 70s 80s do you think it’s more people are vigilant now I think it’s that but also I think it’s because social media paranoid us because like my my mom if some Something happened in Texas most likely didn’t hear about it true but now something happens in Texas with a kid like in just you with the Iowa one year all seeing that and now you as a parent are thinking that were before our parents didn’t see that they didn’t know something happened in Iowa or Texas it’s just this interesting thing of what social media can paranoia us

so do you think that we are being too overprotective of our kids? Yeah, yeah

and myself too like I fight like I’m like I want him to experience freedom and have a chance to make me know not bad choices but you know maybe make a little bit of a stupid choice and you know, but do it while he’s still with us instead of when he’s 22 he does something stupid and it’s way more consequences and so that’s a battle I’ve been having of like I want to give them freedom I’m like dang like what if something happens but I

mean how do you how do you overcome that? You just just do what is do it there’s no like

yeah for me it for me it’s just like okay no I don’t want I feel uncomfortable but just go just do it kind of like you and that you like Avery do it

yeah now we let her dry like she’s biked to cone world which is in referenced Our house is probably like a mile and a half but it’s crossing Ivan rest which is a four lane or no it’s not four lane that used to be four lane they took two lanes oh

yeah for the biking lane.

Yeah people were I was kind of pissed about that too not for the biking they said it’s more efficient doing this way I’m like whatever Yeah, it’s fine. Yeah, you know it is my pet peeve too when I’m turning into my my subdivision if someone goes around me in the left lane I have the horn like that’s not what that thing is for now. If you’re going on Prairie there’s no bike lane like I was biking on Prairie and people were going in that lane around me I’m totally fine with that. Please don’t hit me Yeah, couple times. Oh, like That’s the first time I’ve taken my bike on the road Okay, like three Consumers Energy trucks went by and they weren’t fat they weren’t fast but they were a little too close for comfort for me. I mean that was a giant truck yo and past me so yeah, yeah, I let a Virgo a lot more she you know she likes to dance. She has a phone though. Yeah, that shouldn’t really matter that we didn’t have phones Yeah, we went out to the freakin place

but even cold world like that’s I’m proud of you for that one though. That’s down on a busy street to that it’s

well where I lived I don’t know if you’re familiar with jennison on Baldwin. I lived on Magnolia Okay, which is close to 20 a is it 28th Avenue and Baldwin somewhere around there. I rode my bike down to Meijer and you know, it’s all sidewalks but still. Wow. That’s a hall. Yep. But okay, here is the second clip. Okay, so my daughter is really into the Harry Potter. She’s reading the books. It’s the 20th anniversary. So it’s real big right? The merchants out and everything. Yeah. So she’s got some her friend got a Harry Potter water bottle. And I said after she said that, I’m like, I got a Harry bottle too. Okay, now, jokes that we say. Just go right over her head. Like Megan turned to me and started laughing. She’s like, Dad, that’s disgusting. I said, What do you mean? She’s like, I know what you’re talking about. And I said, No, you don’t. She’s like, yeah, your private parts. I was like, oh, okay, I now have to watch what I well. I should have been watching what I mean. She’s 10 she’s not too Yeah, you know, in this digital age. Yeah, that was that was a little a little It was embarrassing now now then. Now I try to embarrass her with Yeah, stop. So again, my beautiful beautiful wife do not take this the wrong way. But we still haven’t discussed the sex thing and it ebbs and flows like every couple of weeks I’m like hey, are you gonna do it and I’ll do it like we said on the show I’ll do it. I want her protected. I want her to know that I think she knows but now it’s funny like I’ll get pretty not risque but I’ll get pretty just enough to make her blush and she blushes so bad so it’s kind of like flipped us not like hey, I just went to bone your mom. Like not not bad but just some funny jokes like that. Oh, yeah. I’m trying not full pa that’s not the right. Right term for it, but stuff like that. So

yeah, no. Do you ever worry that When you say that around your kids, they’re gonna say that at school. I

think I put the fear in God and my kids, okay, like, I will swear quite a bit in front of solid. Yeah. And he’ll be like it. Like if I dropped the F word. And I was like, yep, you don’t say that. And I think it’s not. I shouldn’t come off that guy. Do what I say not what I do. I said, but I always say, you know, it’s, you do that in an appropriate place. Yeah. In school is not. Yep. You know, with your friends. Maybe. But I also with the app, I run bark with Avery’s phone if I see one of her friends dropped the app. I was like, because it doesn’t, it doesn’t read everything. It only reads that stuff. Okay, so if her friend drops the F bomb, it’ll it’ll flag it and Okay, what’s up with this? You know what I mean? So I don’t know it sounds very hypocritical doesn’t it? That I swear in front of my kids, but I don’t want them I mean, there’s a time and a place for it. And I’m an oversquare I will admit,

well, like and I swear and it’s interesting too with cam like trying to teach him like school is not the place to do it. Probably with your friends on the street. Probably not the place to do it. Like if you’re around here and like and again all depends on the mood like you know, he would try to cuss me out but like, it’s interesting because he’s getting to the age where you know, the word shit is funny to say but like, he doesn’t know exactly where to say that. Yeah, and I’m like, I’m waiting from the call from his, you know, Christian church and conservative Christian school. Yeah.

Yeah, I think it’s fine to swear with your friends. Yeah, if you’re not like mF this mF that if you drop a hammer on your foot, you’re screwing around with your friends you drop a mF or I think that’s okay with your friends. I do that in front of your teacher.

Yeah, and it depends what friends and family but you know it’s that rule like okay, like there’s certain places you can say things even like you know jokes about you know, bots and penises and all Yeah, like you know, we’ll do that home but like don’t Okay, schools not the place for that

it’s one of those so there was a judge way back in the day that talked about pornography and setting I don’t know what it is, but when I see it, I’ll know it. It’s kind of like that. swearing like yeah, I can’t tell you like you can you can do it in front of your friends but don’t do this. Like it’s a it’s all kind of a gray situation. For sure spot. So this one is about apparently large groups, which I brought up recently in the last maybe 10 episodes. recap this a little bit. So we’ll play this and Mike will tell me why I’m wrong. Surprisingly, as introvert as extroverted I am I don’t like large groups either. It’s a big problem for me. Now if I know somebody, then lets you know I’m going to talk your ear off. But yeah, I don’t I think some of it has to do with the the story for me growing up, but for some reason affects me like it used to I couldn’t go to Costco, like when I would go to Costco and it would get crowded and people would bump into me I would lose my ass. You know what I mean? Like it would like, one time I had I had solly on my shoulders. Or maybe it was a rain maybe she had a dress on or something blocked my vision. And I felt some lady like taught Sally or give them a high five or mess. I’m like, What are you doing? Like I was freaking out and I told me and I’m like, I gotta go like I put the kid down and walked out but so why did you pull this clip?

That’s so surprising because you’re such a people person. I think later on you said you know, you can go to Cedar Point. What? Like what exactly is it about stores? It seems to be store?

Does? That’s a good question. No one’s ever really like why you can go to Cedar Point. Yeah, you’re not. I think. I think a lot of it is people’s attitude around where they’re where their bodies is present. Okay, so when you’re at Cedar Point, everyone knows there’s going to be lines. Everyone kind of gets the thing. You don’t really have people like standing in the way or just being oblivious to what’s going on, you know, but yeah, I don’t know. It was. It’s always been stores. Okay. Um, yeah, I’ve always been to amusement parks. It’s never been an issue. But I don’t know what it is. Is it like

a pure panic sets in or like what? Yeah, really?

Not like, I’ve never really had a panic attack. Okay. And I know Megan has experienced that, but I haven’t. I don’t know if you have. I don’t even know what times Yeah, yeah. So yeah, I don’t know if I can ever figure it out. I just kind of take myself out. Megan has gotten to the point where it’s way less than what it was, but I’m like, You know what? I think I’m gonna set this one. Yeah. And she’d be like, cool. We’ll be back in like 15 minutes. I’m like, sweet. I

appreciate that. Yeah, it was just so interesting. Because you like people you love other crowds. I just, I found that interesting.

Yeah. And I can go to concerts too. I don’t know if it’s like we’re all there for the same seat that I mean, I guess at Costco you’re all there for the same purpose shopping, but I just feel like more people are more assholes in the shopping center. Oh, you’re at a concert. Was there at a party and most the time like I’ll have somebody bumped into me it’s cool that happens again we’re gonna like calm down like I’ve done it a couple Bobby because there’s I’m not up in the old you know Marsh I want to I’m back you know in my own space yeah fun you start slamming in me a couple of times you need to stop drinking and yeah Frick away from me but for the most part I’m fine

with anyways yeah interesting well I hope you enjoyed that memory injured listen back to hear them talk about sports and baseball that was a beautiful I just was sitting there last don’t know what to lead off guys we can talk about that later Yeah,

we need like someone needs to like do a fact check episode so Mike decided that we have a mental health update but we’re gonna do two questions as Mike and I know each other I mean we probably know each other as much as you in band because you guys didn’t really connected college right? You knew them but it’s not like you know, Ben was that hot shit on. I mean, if you can be hot shit at corners. I mean, he was and I was not that was so comical when I, when I heard that episode or upper echelon. I’m like, I really want that. And he will in his own time. This is not critical, Ben. So don’t don’t take it that way. But like it the way you were presented in college, and then the way you are now I feel like Ben struggles a little bit with self confidence. I mean, it’s it. That’s no secret. And I’m a cocky asshole. That’s no secret, either. But I wonder what happened to Ben or I thought about this. And I may have said it on the podcast. And you know, correct. I talk so much. But maybe I said to Megan, I think that Ben was kind of forced into ministry. Yeah, I really do. Yeah, I don’t know if he really wanted to. But he remember him talking about like the rest of life stuff. And like he was the chosen one and everything. And I wonder if he went in with that attitude. And I talked about this on the podcast,

a podcast or some other time? I don’t know. I’ve heard it. And you just Yeah, that makes sense.

I’m curious to hear that story. I’m sure he knows or he’s working through it. And when it comes out, so

what if you and I interview him about that? as a guest?

I don’t think he’ll answer. I know, but maybe someday. You’ve heard the show. I’ve tried to beat him up a little bit to tell more on the show. Cuz I want to know I want to personally I bet listeners want to know too. So. Alright, two questions. Yep. And these are just these are a little bit. I went a little bit deeper with mine. Yeah, I

didn’t do too. Yeah. Okay, Who wants to go first? I will go first for you. You know, it’s funny as I was gonna put them in, in the show notes for you. And I actually had them there. You’re like, Nope, I don’t want to see Oh, I

appreciate that. Because you always I always tell people I have trouble thinking on my feet. Yeah, I don’t think that’s fair. Okay. I was going for fairness tonight and not like me not sound like an idiot because I can’t think

okay, well, and you know what, we can always add out any like long pauses. So all I do

Just so you know, yo, yeah, which you should.

As somebody who listens, thank you for doing that.

Like, so. And there’s sometimes like seven seconds. I’m like, Ben, you get three.

So if you could go back and change one moment of your life, what moment would you change? And what would you do differently in that moment?

You know, what, my question, there’s one of those is really similar. Okay. It’s, it’s not the same, but I gave you an out on mine, too, which I probably shouldn’t have. So can you repeat that? Because

if you could go back and change one moment of your life, what moment would you change? And what would you do differently in that moment?

I don’t think there’s anything. I mean, I’ve made a lot of poor decisions. Yeah, I don’t know. I, there’s some things that I’ll be honestly, there’s some things I haven’t said on the show. Okay. That I don’t want to I’m not ready yet. It’s so long ago. It’s not a big deal. But it was when I was in my 20s. But a lot of I think a lot of decisions I made around my ex wife. Okay. There was some violence involved between both of us. Okay, and I spent a few nights in the clink. And I wish I wouldn’t have done that. I don’t think that changed the trajectory, but I just can’t believe I did that. I know why I did that. Because that’s all I knew. Yeah. Is violence. Yeah. I mean, that’s all I knew. Yeah. And, yeah, I probably would have wish I would have taken a beat like I did with you and gone away for 24 hours. Yeah, instead of that, but yeah, we used to scrap pretty hard, okay, but unfortunately, the guy always gets that. Yeah, for sure. And the girls do too, but not as much, but I guess that that would be one of them. Okay. Yeah, that was kind of, I don’t know. I feel like it’s not a good answer.

I think it’s a good answer. I think those are okay. Like it’s not like that one. Most people have that one moment, but like, yeah, there’s your your 20s with your ex wife. I mean those that is

honestly The one thing that changes so I’ll be honest with you It gave me I had a couple charges okay a couple of them and for the longest like I had a couple of domestic violence charges This is no one’s ever heard this and one of them got dropped one of them I be at a jury trial. Okay, he lost while she lied on the stand. Okay. So they’re like, yeah, this this No, yeah. But for the longest time I was on able to, I think carry a pistol. Okay, and that was always a big deal for me. Yeah, because it was my right and apparently, after a certain amount of time, that just doesn’t apply anymore and those issues were over 20 years ago. It also affected me on my jobs. Yeah, I bet like I always had that weird feeling Should I check? Yes, I’ve been convicted of a crime and sometimes I did sometimes I did yeah,

you’re hoping and the ones you didn’t Well, they want to chat Yeah,

so that has always been an issue with me with career wise. It’s just I feel bad for people especially like these people that have these small marijuana charges Yeah, like you need to expose that shit like marijuana is legal now. I mean, they shouldn’t have to not get a job because of you know that No, mine was violence I will I will admit it’s it’s more serious than than marijuana but it was 20 years ago as isolated incident yeah like let’s move the hell

yeah one that’s the thing right having 20 years ago you’ve changed you’ve grown Yeah, no, no when you and Megan got together was that something that made her nervous?

Yeah, I told her everything Yeah, yeah, I mean I told her everything I’m sure it did. And I have had I mean I have grown so much I mean with her and I like I’ve never gotten physical with her Yeah, but I have been damn close and I have lost my shit yeah, like major lot like i’ve i’ve broke doors in the house like I our bedroom door cost $300 because I had to somebody come like custom make the door cuz I you know, so, but I’m working through that. And it’s it’s so much better but yeah, yeah. Okay. All right. My question for you. It’s very similar. Tell me one thing from your childhood that changed your trajectory. Good or bad. I wanted to say just bad, but I don’t think that’s fair. Because who knows if you don’t have anything bad like, and that’s basically like, you know, something happened. I mean, to tell me the dirty dirty deets, but um, we all got a little bit of shit in our closet that that happened to us that maybe it was bad or maybe something that was good that you’re like, wow,

um, can you read that back again? I like you. I’m trying to pry Oh,

isn’t that hard? I tried to talk longer so you could process but but then I mess it up. Tell me one thing from your childhood that change your trajectory like something that happened that you thought maybe you you could have gone this way because you probably don’t know if you happen when you’re six. You’re like, Oh, this didn’t happen. Yeah, I would have done this but this did happen was amazing. And now I guess, like just in general. Yeah. And well,

no, and I’ll go there and I like my dad’s listening like I don’t mean this in any bad way. But my dad growing up had a temper beyond belief. Like, great guy. Like he he like wanted me to succeed. You know, he’s a classic Dutch dad. He didn’t tell me you know how much he loved me and all that because Dutch dads just don’t share that but he you know, like, like, if, like if I started playing bass while he would go out he would help me get lessons. I think so I get my obsessiveness from he’s helped me get lessons he would do this. He would play catch with me he would help you’d catch as I tried to pitch and all that. But there was always that waiting for that temper to happen. Yeah, so eggshells eggshells and again like you know his dad coming home in a good mood is coming home and a pest off mood. And then I was me and I can be an ass sometimes. And so like, I think I like could egg that on sometimes. And so yeah, I think a lot of trajectory is like, I think it makes me more anxious about the future because I’m always like, what else is going on? Or when there’s something bad gonna happen when is that explosion going to happen? So like I think that was one it’s not one moment again, but it’s those moments I think really changed a lot of trajectory trajectory because

I think you would be a less anxious person if that wasn’t there. Yeah, because now

I’m always waiting for the bad thing to happen yeah, the other shoe to drop Yeah, like if somebody brings me into their their office for a meeting and doesn’t tell me what it’s about. I’m like, that’s the band’s the same way the worst case scenario and I think it goes back to that Now, to be fair, my dad’s worked a lot on it and he’s you know, grown from that he’s he’s owned his shit with that but like yeah, looking back I think that really affected a lot of how I interact even now and have had you know, therapy and other things. You know, one of that

one of the things that I think my kids are going to need therapy for me because my kids are gonna need their Yeah, there is the shelter. Yeah, I’ve really tried work through. If dad’s pissed off it’s like that’s dad’s problem. Yeah, you know what I mean? And Avery um it’s not so much Sally Sally with the Autism is kind of oblivious yeah a lot of stuff Yeah, he doesn’t mean he doesn’t get upset but he doesn’t see the eggshell stuff Yeah, like Avery does

and you know and I see that in Intel I went up there be like you know in marriage and with with even cam like I had a temper Yeah, a wicked temper like he’ll go from being the most happy guy to just pissed off you know? Like I don’t think I’ve ever punched a hole in the door but like i i i can scream with the best of them and being a big dude me screaming is not fun for anybody Yeah, so you know I think that goes back to that you know that’s that’s how I learned how to deal with it you know just bottle up and then boom blow it out.

Yeah, there’s a story where I and I’m sure I told on the show, but maybe I did that’s a problem with 140 episodes. You don’t know what you’ve told 139 Oh, yeah, almost come I rounded up and I was talking to my ex wife and she at that time she was like Yeah, you’re not gonna see your son even the court ordered like she was like doing that kind of stuff. And it was windows Motorola razor phones came out they’re actually come back. Yeah, yep, I took that thing and just threw it. I was on 196 eastbound come from I don’t know Byron center and I threw that sucker right out the window. Yeah, I was just so pissed at those kinds of things. Yeah,

I like to destroy stuff when I’m angry. have figured that out. You should you should have like a room of just stuff that you can break.

Well there’s a place in Byron center that you can go that’s all they have in there you really like 20 bucks and you can smash bottles and you work goggles and you have a sledge hammer. And that’s all they do. Oh, wow. They must just go to like grad sales and collect stuff for 10 cents and you know, then you get to rage out in a room. That’s awesome. Must have to sign up pretty big waiver. Yeah, I

bet I bet I bet you do. That’s awesome. What’s your second one? Ken? Can you remember a time in your life when you felt the most alive? And then tell us as much about that as possible? most alive?

Oh, man. I don’t know. Either. Tough.

I also googled some tough, like deep questions. You know,

I started Googling it and then they weren’t they weren’t deep enough. And I was like, man, I need to sit down. Take a deep breath and think Yeah, I don’t know. I would say none.

Okay, I know that socks you never felt like alive even for a moment.

I’ve never done anything like skydiving or anything like that. I mean, I can probably say like the half marathons honestly, like when you get done and you have a good race. Yeah, it’s amazing. Okay, you’re just Yeah, I don’t have anything. I feel bad.

Get married to Megan like can you throw that in for Oh, no. I mean

like to me alive. It’s just like you all your senses are awakened just like yeah, you know, I think a lot of it. I have that a lot with music. Okay. I’m a big like, goose bump. You know, I introduced you to pop evil. Yeah, a lot of that stuff. I will just electrify but I can’t see that say that. There’s a specific moment. Do you have one?

I would say at a YouTube concert. Okay, sorry Natalie is not everybody.

Of course that was a one day but like,

just there was a moment where the band went silent. And like they’re in the middle of a song. We are at Spartan Stadium and the only good thing that ever happened to Spartan stadium was it was a YouTube concert. And it just everyone just started singing so 70 some 1000 people just singing the lyrics whenever they cut out yeah and it’s just it was just one of those moments you just felt like you were floating in there like I was on no drugs no alcohol nothing Yeah, and it was like an almost an out of body experience. Oh yeah. So I like if I had to say one of those like, most alive it had to be at a YouTube cancer

that’s cool. I never saw you too. I wasn’t a big YouTube fan but you know the Rolling Stones are coming to Greiner or no, they’re Detroit Okay, and I’m not a fan of them, but I’m like I should buy ticket Yeah, I’m never gonna see them like but but that’s why I’m never gonna go to my kids. Hey, I went to a rolling like I don’t know that’s not a bad like Guns and Roses show that I went to dude. I mean it’s old school, like or old or old Guns and Roses. It was like five years ago so it wasn’t like back in the heyday. I was a kid then. Yeah, but I’m Megan just laughs because I just sat there was that little caesars arena Okay, that’s how new it was. Yeah, because that’s not been a long I just was like staring like I didn’t even have the greatest seats we were way up there but just watching slash play and just was freaking amazing.

Yeah, cuz you know, at the YouTube cancer. I mean, we have the crappy seats.

Oh, yeah, I’m not paying already. I think we paid like 100 and a quarter. Yeah. And then We’re 10 rows from the top yep like those guys made some bank on that yeah I can’t remember what to or they called it

but but yeah it’s something about music with that like it just yeah to me that’d be like the out of body or otherwise like rappelling down a mountain did that once okay most alive because I thought I was gonna die hanging off anyways this this was your question

yeah but i like i like to hear your responses yeah the the it’s funny you bring up the auto body when I do get super angry I almost go out of body is so intense It’s so scary yeah yeah I don’t wish that on anybody yeah for all that get that that was weird okay tell me about your job career from young to now so when you started out in your teens like what kind of stuff I know you’ve done some landscaping and stuff like that yep and your youth pastor Now how did you get the calling to become that so I want to hear about all your dirty jobs yeah for your

my first job actually was work I was actually in kindergarten I’m kg now come I know this was I actually worked at my grandpa’s farm driving a bagel tractor in kindergarten because I was tall and I was I was able to reach the pedals to reach the pedals my grandpa was short staffed he called up my mom my mom wouldn’t let me mow the grass for years to come and that makes sense but so did that but anyway so and then in like sixth grade again worked for my grandpa for a few years and then I worked for a different farm and you know catch the theme grew up in Hudson Valley yeah let us farm so did that for a few years salad salad bowl city salad bowl city you know yeah actually went they actually had this world record like salad bar thing at the time. This was after like I got married I actually went to bat

I want to be part of it. Yeah, I mean you’ve worked in the fields up there Yeah, cool.

So did let us farm and then I worked at a garden Center in Huntsville for a bunch of years through high school college and then when I first got married and they did taxes but anyway so back to calling in the ministry was actually young life I was just volunteering there because I was like hey I did in high school this great way to give back nothing and that was actually a grand rally for a totally different major and a couple of people were like you know you’re doing really good at this Have you ever thought about this as a career and I laughed at them and like totally was like yeah yeah, you don’t understand and there’s some things in the way I was like you know, that’s not for me but again through time it just felt like you know, this is right for me and suddenly the worst part was telling my parents like so I’m going to Grand Valley which was like 5000 a year wasn’t going for for engineering which is going to make pretty good money but I want to go to Cornerstone where tuitions like 14 at the time it’s more now but yeah, and I’m gonna make less How does that sound? And I remember telling my mom that she’s like, you know if God’s calling you you should go do and I was like, Damn, okay, so I transferred to Cornerstone halfway through that’s where I met Ben upper echelon Ben

Oh progression I know you need like a sticker or whatever they go we keep talking about it we we had the ladies at one point record those and it just they couldn’t get into so we never used them but

so anyways I graduated but I had the opposite experience of men were men yet like right into job I didn’t get a full time ministry job right away. So continue to work the garden center did taxes then I ended up at a pregnancy center then at a church okay that’s how I got where I’m at now so

Oh, very cool. Yeah. Yeah, I just it’s always weird when I meet people that are in ministry like I don’t know if some people fit well I don’t get the take no offense I just from what I know I don’t know if but I don’t know you in the ministry. Yeah there so I just know you as Mike Yeah, I mean, not that you don’t like live like some hypocrite outside of the church, but you know your mic. You know what I mean? I don’t look you as a pastor there there makes me so proud. Why? Because I don’t want to be that long and well, I’m a pastor. Like, you got to like act different.

I mean, don’t Yeah, just just just be you. And I’ll just be me.

Okay. Well, that’s fair. Like, Ben. I actually see more of that. I call it NPR Ben. Oh, yeah, you know what I mean, like when he did his podcast while it was really good, I did enjoy it. Yeah, it was. It was NPR Ben and I think Ben kind of lives his life that way. That’s not a bad like he lives boring. He does he does a lot of cool stuff but I mean I don’t know I just get that vibe more from him because he’s more introverted. Yep, I guess but anyways, well good. That was good. Didn’t get too crazy. Jump into mental health update we’ll do this real quick because we’re at probably an hour right now. Although there’s a lot of shit I got added there’s a lot so for me I’m just gonna say we’re still working on Meg and I, we went to therapy together with my therapist, as you know the insurance company while we’re not paying to insurance company right now anyways, but stupidly enough. The insurance company doesn’t cover couples therapy Really? No. So they don’t want couples to work on whatever and that’s stupid. You can go to individual but you can’t work out together Come on priority, how well it’s all of them, or all of them just in general in general, they stupid. It’s the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard. So obviously I go to Heather, and then Megan comes in. And so we are, we’re working through it. Megan and I are struggling as far as just kind of live in a little bit of parallel lives. Yeah. And we don’t want to look 20 years from now be that way and go, you know, what effort? Yeah, you know, and I have a lot of work to do on it. It’s not like, you know, it’s weird. It’s like you’d almost we’re not fighting really, it’s almost like you’d rather be fighting because at least there’s passion around it. And so we’re working through that. Don’t everyone fret everything’s good. We’re not we’re not one step to the divorce lawyer by any means.

But you guys are trying to prevent that when the kids move out of the house. You’re awesome. Like, who in the world are you?

Yeah, yeah. And we’re, we’re both working on each other. And we’ve both kind of like, when Megan and I got together, we I leaned on her a lot. You know what I mean? And she leaned back so we’re like, you know, together all the time. And then I started going to therapy and I started getting comfortable in myself. Okay, so then I started lean away. I’m like, I can take care of myself. Yeah. And then now Megan, who who is always the helper is going to therapy and she’s like, you know, I don’t need really need to help anymore. So now we’re this kind of parallel and we got to figure out a way how to get back together. So while we’re doing good things separately, we need to focus on doing those things together.

And what you guys have been doing checkins right? Is that what I’ve heard on your podcast Monday nights?

So this is number four tomorrow? How’s that going? It’s going okay, there’s still some we actually talked about it today. And I was like, I don’t know what these are supposed to be and she’s like, well, I don’t either I’m like well, we have to figure it out. Yeah. And I said if you want to talk about something like we’ve talked about put it in the calendar it sounds stupid, but I’m like, I will honor that calendar. Like if you come to me, which she did today and she’ll hear this and chuckle a little bit or maybe stab me I don’t know. I’m working on editing and she comes down and sits down and she did give me the opportunity to say no but i i was like i did the pause and I shouldn’t have I should have said no that’s fine. It is fine yeah you know and so that’s what I don’t like I don’t like the pop in I like if you have something if you want to circle back on some let’s put in the count Yeah, no honor that time Yeah,

so what is this Monday night? checkins supposed to be I probably should have listened more closely.

No, we don’t know I’m just like how was your weekend? How was your week how was your week coming up? It’s not a lot of business talk like it’s not supposed to be household Craig bills and all that stuff. Okay, it’s not supposed to be that we have to ask each other at the end if we want to discuss Okay, that I’m honoring because that that can derail our treasure for sure like someone’s pissed about the money or whatever but I’m really into like I want you to schedule it and cozy like say hey, I’d like to talk to you Thursday night I’ll look at cozy I’m like sounds good I got nothing put it in there and I and she worries that I’m gonna knock the gate that are not doing I’m like if you put it in cozy Yeah, I will honor that. Okay, so

let’s see we’re getting there seems to be I mean at least some connection there right? It’s bringing those lights back. Now how is it like I thought about I think I heard this on the last episode. How’s it having Megan come to to your therapist, like it feels like she’s invading your space? Or is it okay?

I’m totally okay with Okay, I’m comfortable with I mean, it’s you know, I guess if you got some skeletons that you haven’t told your wife it would be a problem but Megan knows everything and even if I did I would just tell my therapist don’t bring this up. Obviously she would honor that But no, I don’t have a problem at all.

I wasn’t sure if you know if like your safe space became like the battleground. I mean, battlegrounds a terrible word to use but as you’re as you’re trying to figure things out, like I didn’t know if that made your like safe space

alone. I will say I think Heather does. There’s no sides there but I think she does. Err on my side there have been some times where it’s like well, Jason’s done that that the DA and not to be mean to Megan but then she’s like Mike is like, Oh, yeah, I guess I didn’t look at it that way. So I will say how there does stay on my side and we I don’t go in there for that. Yeah, yeah. I don’t go in there to like settle this argument. I go. I go in there to make shit right? Yeah, I want to be better. Yep. All around. Yep. What about you?

It was interesting. I didn’t get through the whole last episode where you guys talked about it. I’m trying to figure out what like what my thing is to deal with mental health.

Yeah, I don’t even I don’t think you are going. seeing a therapist currently. Yeah,

not now. And I don’t think that’s in the cards. Like again, you know, like, you know, that’s even why not budget wise, like,

I mean, my unhealthy people go to therapy.

I know. And I’m not healthy. So I mean, none of us are but but again, like I feel like my therapist who really had set up a lot of tools like and he’s like, you definitely know how to do this. It’s just doing it and I totally figured out what my way of dealing with it crap in my life yeah you know just the other day I had a student whose friend got got got a car accident with a semi you know and so I’m dealing with that like there’s just things I take on that I have to figure out how to process because I think it is it’s getting to like a numbing stage and I know for me when I numb that’s when it’s dangerous so I don’t know if it’s a journaling and I don’t know if it’s you know, well I’ve been doing less kayaking I don’t know what it is but I definitely need to figure out what my expression of all the stuff that I’m facing.

Yeah, I mean if you can handle it yourself I know a month or two ago you were talking to us about some some things going on in your life that was giving you some pretty high anxiety on you were even thinking about medication and I actually said hey man, I would talk to a therapist before he jumped up some meds Yep, I don’t know what happened with that we never talked about it and you don’t have to talk about it but so I don’t know I just think everyone should have a therapist on speed dial not like I text like I literally don’t text my therapist I’m not like that but I’m just saying you know I was kind of in a dead zone and I don’t want to give her up though. Like I was like I probably could do a six month break so I was like so now Megan and I are gonna go yeah that’s what we’re gonna do because I don’t want to lose her

I know what especially if you have your spot like reserved yeah you don’t want to lose that

I’m already losing my Wednesday at five she wants spend more time at home totally get it so in the winter it’s fine super flexible but summer I mean to do a four o’clock appointment I’m gonna have to miss a little bit of work you’re gonna be hustling network. So what about a takeaway? is I don’t know what I’ve learned from this show. We need to get rid of this stuff.

You know what though? No, I I think it’s so interesting. We probably had a lot different childhoods, but there’s a lot of the same things I keeps seeing out of us lay it’s parallel. It’s parallel, yet different, right? And that’s what’s so hard. Like, we probably each want to offer like, Hey, this is what you should do because it’s we’ve something similar, but just it’s interesting how, when you grow up with anger and the temper how that translates through to adulthood, and you have to work so dang hard. Well, yeah. And as an adult to get rid

of it. Yeah, the last couple shows, I don’t remember we just kind of had a pep talk with the listeners like hey, you’re gonna mess your kids up. Like, you don’t realize how impactful like I even said in this show, Ava is gonna need therapy for me because she has to walk on eggshells at times with me and I know that like it actually doesn’t bother me that much that I know that and that might be sick because I’ve come so far and like I tell Megan I’m like I’m sorry like I’ve done as much as I can do you know I don’t beat my kids I don’t do any of that that my mom did and if they have to go to therapy because I kind of unpredictable at times I guess I can live with it I feel bad yeah. But I’m working on it I mean it’s not a flip of the switch

Yeah, so I mean you’ve kind of set the expectation like everyone goes to therapy you’re gonna get therapy because of me and cam is gonna need there because of me and of course then probably because Natalie Do you know like

yeah I mean in and now that every gosh that was like three and have to say some after the show about that, but uh lost my train of thought is that I’ve been talking way too much but yeah, I don’t really have any takeaways other than I really enjoy shooting the shit with you and enjoyable we need to excited about your future prospect of a podcast that I possibly be the first guest and it will pass so interesting to me. I mean I feel like I’m not interviewing you and this one is yeah mutual but it will be nice to be on the other side of the mic

there’s just a totally different like I am I’m gonna have all the screens in you’re gonna be sitting there with

a tablet or there’s no screen I’m literally looking at the same thing you are just have like the one screen is a picture of my family. There’s literally nothing on it right now.

Which looks looks really cool though. Yeah, wow. Yeah,

it looks can be deceiving. So well. Thank you guys so much for listening to threads, podcast life unfiltered. We really appreciate it. Hope you enjoyed this episode. We’ll be back. You know, initially I thought Chris cow Kenya was going to step in for Ben, but I think I’m going to be able to record because I’m gone next week. Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday in Nashville, for podcasting. Whoo, man, sad nerd. So I think that I might be able to, I don’t know. So who knows it could be me and Ben, it could be Ben in Pisco Canyon next week. So thanks a lot, guys.

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