Transcription #137

On 70 insane we take controversial sensitive subjects and discuss them openly and freely. politics, religion, money, culture, and more. We bring on a variety of guests but most importantly, we bring on you our listeners to say what needs saying with check us out on your favorite podcast platform YouTube or at our website say what needs saying calm? Come join the conversation on say what needs saying the most controversially civil conversation podcast. I guys, welcome to threads, podcast life on filter, thank you so much for joining us tonight or tomorrow, or whenever you’re listening to this, this is Episode 137. Our take on current events. So yeah, we’re gonna kind of talk about some uncomfortable things, some, whatever things who knows, we’re not really gonna, I don’t know, it’s not really a format tonight. So just kind of change things up a little bit. But before we do that, Ben is going to talk about threads, what threads is all about what we’re doing, and then nice direction and intro to our guest.

threads. podcast life unfiltered is all about conversations regarding things that matter. We want to create a space where it’s okay to talk about faith, our mental health. And as we do that, we often talk about uncomfortable stuff as well. Tonight, we’re trying something a little bit different. We have three of us here tonight, we’ll let you know who the third person is in just a minute. But we each have picked a current event or a happening or something that is of interest to us, that we just want to talk about. And we’ll see where the conversation goes. It’s first time we’ve done an approach like this, but I’m excited about it. So Jason, who do we have here with us?

While we have Mike vandrie from the debunked skeptical pastor podcast? Possibly your? Yep. Are you done with that?

I don’t know. I am I am selling the border, not whether or not I am going to continue. I got to Episode 10. And I took a break. Not sure I’m going to continue back up but I have something else in in other works that I won’t tell you guys. Yeah, yeah.

You have to apply that song already.

I have to blue ball.

Yes. No, yeah. Yeah. Well, why why the pause of the podcast just life got in the way and then you didn’t want to go back or did you lose interest?

yes to both and I’m questioning a lot of things that I think that’s good, but it also makes it so that I don’t know, I have some it’s really hard to say but but life got in the way. June was a terribly busy month. Right. And I thought it was gonna take June off and I got to July. Coming back, so we’re not sure I’m not sure if it’s coming back. We will see what August brings dauterman TBD.

Yeah. So for those of you know, Mike’s been on the show, some things have changed in our dynamic a little bit. I don’t know if we ever talked about it. But Mike and I are doing a tough mudder together. We started working out Ben’s working out. He’s not joining us any of those adventures at this point, but maybe next year. But so then also Mike and I are gonna actually try to tackle a half marathon too crazy so we have not signed up for it yet just in case we both get a break our legs like Conor McGregor at self monitor. So at least we can save $150 Yep. But I plan on signing up after tough mudder so but yeah, it’s been it’s been fun. Ben and I went biking on Saturday and I almost said the F word 16 miles my sit bones are like so they calm right the sit bones right writer. I think that’s what they call it our little tender.

But don’t let Jason fool you. He said that 16 miles as if it was like some arduous task. I was panting and just dying trying to keep up with you. Well,

we weigh different weights. I mean, if you put an 80 pound back pack on my back, I would be in the same boat You were so

maybe it made it good. And then maybe the next time you go, you should strap a backpack to him with some weights.

Well, I initially went out I told him I’m like, you need to take it easy. I mean, like, I haven’t ridden a bike enough. I mean, it’s I mean, I’ve written like my kids bike around, but I haven’t owned a bike and probably 20 years, 25 years. And so I was like, I did like one little loop around the play or play around the neighborhood just to kind of get a feeling on it. And I was like, take it easy on me. But then I settled in and I’m like, Oh, this is fun. So yes. So how are you guys showing up tonight? This is something we’d like to do. Just to kind of get the room tone. How’s everyone feeling? Coming in tonight, Mike?

I am in kind of a shitty mood but let me explain why. So I end up waking up really good. Felt good after running 3.1 miles yesterday. farthest I’ve ran and five years. How much should I run? Probably 20 because you’re still 3.2 just Did you really? Yes. Oh, I didn’t see that. I

posted it tonight.

No Oh, just to beat him by that yes by the point one. But anyway, so I this first time I’ve done in five years and I woke up good. Wasn’t sore, I end up going to church. talked about the trip we took with the high schoolers went great and then I got a migraine and then I tried some natural ways to take care of it cuz I don’t like medicine and then like Farrah Gunn had Natalie do that so to help so finally took medicine so I’m finally like just coming off of that and kind of in that like afterglow of like a migraine no I’m talking about oh yeah,

yeah he gets some pretty I’ve get them occasionally I take excedrin right away like the second I am because I’ve had terrible migraines the second I have a tinge of pain in my head to excedrin migraine go right in my mouth I have it in my lunch pail probably shut

up probably should have but also like that medicine messes with my stomach and I try not to take it Yeah, but anyway he pulled out of it because you would not have been able to get to I would not have come here like it was so bad it was in my eye. You know? So I was not sure I was gonna make it

do you think maybe you were dehydrated from yesterday all the work yesterday could have been and

then I had some food that can sometimes make my stomach a little upset. So I don’t know. Not sure what it is. But I’m here ready to go now, but at first I was like, I’m not sure I’m making it. Yeah. Good migraines.

What about you, Ben,

I’m showing up pretty good I I was telling the guys earlier today I spent the afternoon in the kitchen. That’s rare for me to commit a whole block of time but it happened. So I have these recipes that I found and I decided that I was gonna make them again because everybody loved them and they were a hit. So I made three different things and put them in the fridge so we can have them to eat for lunch and whatnot during the week. Yeah, I didn’t quite expect to spend so much time in the kitchen but I got all all kinds of steps in and was moving to and fro so

you had a strain today from the kitchen where apparently I didn’t I haven’t looked at whoop all day. So

if you look at the heart rate you can see from like 230 until 530 ish. It’s minor but it is a little elevated because I’m walking around yeah doing stuff.

Let’s go. They say for for managing your weight in your healthy eating prepping at the beginning of the week is a big deal. I’m trying because how easy is it just to go grab a snack from the gas station. Oh easy or whatever. But if you have everything right there you just open

it up. Exactly. And everything that I made is relatively healthy.

And the chocolate well did use dark chocolate

now. Yeah, but also

like if you want something chocolate, but it’s better than a candy bar on the gas station. So definitely 100% definitely have to have chocolate in there somewhere.

Yeah, they’re definitely they’re like, healthy version of Reese’s. Almost. Okay, but there’s granola in them. So anyway, that was today. yesterday. Had a good Good day. bike ride was awesome. Got lunch afterwards it was it awesome. It was awesome in that you pushed me and in the moment. No, it was

me in front. So then I’m like, Okay, yeah, that’s a rabbit let’s put I’ll be the rabbit and the only one time I look back he was pretty far and I don’t know what happened.

I was like I was gulping sips of water. Okay, yeah, I’m dying here.

Yeah, I was I did enjoy it though. It was I got a new seat. I got it today.

It’s already here. Dude.

I don’t understand what this fast shipping Amazon’s gonna be here on Tuesday. All of a sudden get a notification day. Your seat is out for delivery. I’m like I ordered it yesterday. I’m

jealous. Get that

by us. But no, the bike was good. Yeah, we should all go

good. Yes, but mine is the rabbit mine is the big old cruiser we’re like the bat handlebar so I can say daughter has. Yeah, I know your daughter. But like I like I hate bending over with biking. Just I don’t know. For some reason. It just makes me mad. So I got like the big old bent handlebars like a beach cruiser. Okay,

well, Jason has the handlebar extender if you ever want to use No I didn’t. I got rid of it. I gave it I gave it to them. Well,

how much did you pay for it? I know it’s a piece of pipe it can be more $1,000 I paid three bucks.

But now that’s what you do when you’re done with the part you just leave it at the shop. Right?

So anyways, yeah, sorry to cut in. You had your bike day you were talking about yesterday. Yeah, I didn’t know where you’re finished.

And then things got a little heated and I don’t know if that’s coming up later. And it’s

not but we can talk about it.

I mean, why not? You

know, you guys got in a fight and I’m sitting there in the middle. Again, going

well ever the day before he wanted to stab you in the throat. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, he was just Mr. snark back and Paul

even talked. He’s like, I’m on a kick Mike’s ass. Like Yeah, he was in his in a mood yesterday. So anyways, go ahead with your story. The story goes,

well premise what we’re doing first. Okay, so all three of us have this gadget on our wrist called a whoop, whoop. Now two of us haven’t done a risk. Jason is Jason and has it on it. No,

there’s a reason Jason works on, on equipment vibrates.

So if, if it vibrates somehow I don’t even understand how it’s super frustrating. For me, I would have it on my steering wheel if my whoop wasn’t just so on my wrist. And if I put my hand on the steering wheel, I would get super high levels of strain. doesn’t make much sense. But whatever. Jason has it on his bicep, because he’s on the machine that vibrates. And it

did make a difference as soon as I switched the bicep because I was getting like 12 or 13. So for the listeners, 21 is the max. Yeah, I was getting 12 or 13 is at work. And Mike’s like, Oh my gosh, I’m so jealous. I’m like, I’m not working that hard, like I do riding around on a machine. I mean, yeah, I have to like load a 50 pound bag, but it’s not like it’s like I’m lifting it up right now. Like 10 times before I dumped out like you’re walking and pushing this machine. Oh, and writing it. The second I switched it to the bicep. It all disappeared. Yeah. Which was good.

The story goes with all of that. Yesterday, the three of us all worked out. We’re getting high strain numbers. Jason goes for a run, makes a video of it from the app sends it to us. Something about two a day to a day. What do you boys doing? Get out? So I was like, Okay, I will. And earlier in the day I had mowed the lawn and I left it on, which kind of triggered Jason a little bit. Maybe not even a little bit. I’m still not sure exactly. What about that was so controversial, but I felt like Jason was telling me that there was this unwritten rule you’re not allowed to mow the lawn and we’re your whoop. And so anyway, I went out for a four mile walk at night. And my perception of Jason was that he was worked up because maybe I was going to beat him in our competition I don’t know. So I went for my walk and we eventually things settled down and I did message Mike I was like, Did I do or say something to make Jason upset? like am I missing something here? What’s going on? When for my walk Jason was actually very level headed and kind of the rest of the night and I sent him and I love you GIF at the end of the day so I think that made it all okay, but that’s my take of what happened yeah,

so then you have this weird thing of because you’ve done this before on the day like you’re trying to like win that day right? Like that last time that happened you you succeeded now this is all dudes do in competition so everyone’s probably listening to go and you guys are a bunch of effing idiot you were like oh it’s fine I’m not gonna do it and I worked really hard now my mind Do I have to work out twice to get the numbers that you guys do that’s that’s how it is because I’m like we’re we’re twice as out of shape and you’re no god no I am not I am not a Greek god I am not so I guess every time those days happen it and i and i actually probably provoked it by setting the video I did I wouldn’t have gone out for a walk if you didn’t send in a video right and so I was just trying to motivate you guys to work and then I got fussy that you use the lawn mowing as part of your work because you know early on I said I’m not going to wear it during lawn because I want it to be reflect actual work and it probably was work for you. It probably was but I mean I want it to reflect like working out like I and maybe that was just me. I don’t know I just thought and I didn’t say it was a rule but I was just fussy about it because it’s like dammit I gotta go work out twice to get these numbers and you go out mowed the lawn and get an extra like 5% strain or whatever 5.0 strain and I just think it was fair.

Not the best part is you guys were fighting and neither one of you made it to my score before I went out on a walk with my dog and neither of you made it to 17.6 so you guys are fighting both messaging me and I’m like guys you guys just need to calm down well

here’s the thing No I did not message you you messaged me but first you said WTF I was like well because

you were like pushing his buttons you guys are like, like wtf is going on? Long Story

Short, I’m competitive and it feels like this is the second time you’ve and again I will let me back up It’s the second time you’ve been like I’m gonna make sure I’m not in third place. And I guess if you get out and work out I guess it’s a win and I guess I will say I did provoke you with a video.

Sure did. And I was watching it with Andy and she’s like, Really? Are you really going to go out now because Jason told you to

Well, I’m glad you took advice and didn’t go to the gym.

Oh man. Yeah, you’d be dead today I would you would be out for like four days.

So that being said, I did get fussy but then Ben actually brought up towards the end which I appreciate. I had some clarity and I was like, you know what the This is stupid. And I sent a nice message and it was true I’m like you worked hard today like it’s all good and you know I’ve been I was I was done with it so I was proud of myself for like, I know I said I was gonna leave it alone and then I came back to it, but I just wanted to I just wanted to be just level headed towards the end. You know what I mean? Yeah. And I feel like that’s a win for me because it bothered me in the moment but and I don’t know why it did. I don’t know it clearly it bothers you, because you’re going out and doing stuff. You know what I mean? You’ve got

under my skin successfully, like you should see that as a win because it’s hard to motivate me to do something well,

and that should be our goal. Regardless, right in this division, this working out, it should be like if I get you to go out and go run more. Yeah, that’s a win for sure. It’s a loss for me.

I mean, I chased you on my bike, and then I chased you by getting a second workout in

and the only reason I did the second because I didn’t feel like I got a workout. I don’t I’m not gonna lie in other leisurely stroll if I would have had a high strain that would have been I would not have ran last night. Yeah, because I went with the intent of working out like, I’m not running today. This is going to be my workout. Right? Because I didn’t know how hard it would be. I don’t know. Yeah, so anyways,


Yeah, clearly we have three very competitive

ebayers room. Yeah. And then some ninja competitive. Oh, for sure. For sure. Like he doesn’t work out for like a couple days. And then he goes out blows out an 18 train and like, how are you walking after?

Jason? How are you doing? Oh.

short short version. Coming in Good. I’m glad we wrapped up whatever that was yesterday. I’m actually I know it seems weird to say that that was a win for me to wrap it up that way with Ben. But it was it’s hard for me to do that and let that stuff go. Good day everyone to camp. So another week without a child excited for that little nervous for never been to overnight camp. Oh, no. With no friends. like wow, walking in completely blind.

Well, hey, at least she’s in the state. Why?

Where’s your kid? miracle. Oh, in Missouri. She had hers. Yeah, yeah, that’s a that’s a hike. But so yeah, coming and good. Excited about excited for tonight’s show. And yeah, let’s get dirty.

Awesome. As we get started with the main portion of our show tonight, the three of us have each picked one article, it could be a current event, it could be something that happened to us. We’ve come to the table with something. And we’re going to try really hard not to get in the minutiae of that something. But more talk about why is this important to us? Or what’s the overall theme that we’re sensing? How does this tie in with the the buckets of our podcast, and having kind of a engaging conversation about each topic? Now we don’t need to get stuck in the details of every story. But we do want to at least summarize the who, what, when, where and why or whatever those questions are, why we’re sharing it. Yeah, that’s kind of just the kind of the basics and then we’ve got some prompts to help us in our discussion. And the goal here is again, we’re not newscasters telling about a story. We’re talking about why it matters to us. And one theme that has been very prevalent in my life is the word burnout. Right? I guess if I wrote that’s two words or one word. But anyway, in my life, burnout has shown itself in a couple of very distinct ways. Being the go getter in college, Mike can probably attest to this. Everybody knew who Ben Crocker was at Cornerstone

which is so strange, because I feel like you were kind of you and you admit it. The fly in the wall in high school? Oh, absolutely.

So I went from fly on the wall. Nobody knew me to. Everybody knows bad and I’m going to make sure everybody knows Ben in college, very weird. I got involved with everything. Like, they put up a sculpture of three crosses. And they asked me to be on the committee for planning the chapel service for it. I did that. When they were hiring a new youth ministry professor, they asked me to go out to lunch and be part of the interview process. I did that. I worked in the multimedia department for chapel I worked in the spiritual for me, I could go on and on. Like I did everything that was offered to me. And I even went out of my way to find things. And I worked so hard that I just burned myself out to exhaustion. And that was rough. And then I can look at when I was a youth pastor, similar things I would just over commit over commit over commit burnout. Well, there’s a different type of burnout that I experienced more recently, and I think it’s Very much due to the pandemic, and just life as it was for that crazy period of time. And life hacker has an article that talks about the different types of burnout. And I thought this was really good and timely. I’ll kind of touch base on the three types and talk about a little bit more of how it relates to me, and then we’ll open it up to conversation amongst us. The three types of burnout, I mentioned one of them, exhaustion, just that working so hard that you have nothing left and then you are just done. And you can’t go on. The other burnout cause or result is cynicism. Sometimes you get so burned out on people, you just become a total cynic. Is that like snarky? Yeah, okay, I think that would be a good one. I’ve

heard that word before. But I didn’t know like what the delay meant term over here, right.

Boomer term.

Yeah, Boomer. Nice. So when you’re cynical, like everything, you just look at everything with a different color. And you look at it in this just hopeless, and so you’re not necessarily exhausted. But you’re jaded. Like you look at everything, and there’s just, it’s just pissy about it. Yeah, you’re upset about everything. I think I fall into that one, quite a bit. When I’m feeling burned out. The last one that they talk about is burnout due to a reduced sense of efficacy. That’s a big word. Yeah,

I’m on I don’t even know what that word

is like sixth grade education. So, I mean, this podcast is me sixth grade not.

So self efficacy is like, it’s almost like self esteem, I guess, seeing yourself as being capable to do what’s before you. And sometimes when, when you’re burned out. And this is sometimes true of me, but not always. You can kind of feel like, you just don’t have what it takes anymore. And so you just you’re more likely to give up, yes, more likely to just walk away doesn’t matter. I can’t do anything about it. I’m not blank enough. And so when I read this article, I thought it was very timely, because as we’re coming out of the pandemic, I think a lot of us are feeling exhausted. There’s probably some who are feeling cynical. And there’s also some who are probably feeling that sense of why even bother, I can’t do anything about this. So the reason I bring it up is I’ve been there, and burnout is hard. But I think that there’s hope. And before I go into any more about it, love to hear what you guys have to say about well,

you said you were coming into something recently of burnout. So I was thought you were gonna reveal like, something specific, but just in general, you’re saying because of the pandemic or?

Well, let’s look at the physical health aspect during the pandemic. I honestly, I was on a really good kick. I had lost 25 pounds. This is back at the end of 2019. And really, yeah, don’t remember that. Even with breaking my back. I was still on a good trend.

Oh, yeah, that’s right. When you did break your back that started this. The stop. Yeah, the slow of it. I remember. Yeah, that’s right.

So there was a trend in 2019 of me losing weight, basically all the things that I’ve been working hard at now. And then the pandemic happened, and I just didn’t care. And a lot of that weight, I put right back on, I think probably all of that weight, and I was then the heaviest that I ever was. And it was definitely a sense of why even bother, like I can’t lose this weight. So coming out of burnout for me, is really what this whole year has been. And that’s been focusing on my physical health and realizing that I can do things to make changes. So that’s just one example. And with that pandemic, for me as well, the thought pattern of work, like I had a really shitty work situation. And it was hard to not be cynical about that or exhausted, and then working at att for that little four month period of time, like constantly feeling exhausted, not being paid until I made a sale, working weekends, evenings, whatever it took, I would say there was just a very much a burnout time. And if I didn’t make the choices that I did, early this year, I would be in a very burned out, exhausted, frustrated, right?

But I think you’ve kind of turn the corner I know personally I think you have that’s my opinion for that the the things that you’ve described

yes and that you know that’s one of the reasons I wanted to bring it up like I’ve done this hard work of going to therapy every week and I’ve done this work of going to the gym and finding two guys to hold me accountable and sometimes kick my ass a little bit so you guys have really helped me avoid burnout but in the past that was not how it was for me like I was I would get burned out more than I’d like to admit

before I want you I want you to go but I think part of it and you and I’ve talked about it like a long time ago think about our friendship okay like before me and this probably goes for me too did you have somebody that you were like close enough to that would kind of call you to the table I

mean yeah, did you I did but it was

it was that that one guy we talked about that yeah the the marriage thing are you they got they broke up or they he’s not friends with you because he doesn’t there was like three episodes ago I’m terrible at remembering stuff. Oh you married somebody or you’re at their wedding or you yes

I was his best man.

Yeah, is it that guy?

I think so. Yeah,

you think so you Why are you at? I’m talking about the friend that you did have that you’re taught that you’re

that you’re referencing I was in his wedding or that I did the wedding for Okay,

I don’t know who’s on first. I will shut up

i think i think i do know who you’re talking about. Yes, that friend. I had him be my best man. And then I just assumed that I would be his because that’s how I thought things were ugly that

works I mean it’s kind of like yeah,

so yeah, I think that was the beginning of the end was his wedding because what was

that the friend you were referencing that you had a friend before me?


Okay, thank you we got home run Yeah, we’re at the home play.

Oh that friend. Yeah, he was for a very significant chunk of my high school and early college years that was him excellent and just totally I don’t know he he gave up and walked away and sexually ghosted me

well that doesn’t prove my point this so we don’t need to digress and I guess my point was I’m I feel like you know you’re doing better now I’m not patting myself on the back I really not no one can say that I just think having an accountability partner and somebody that’s I pretty much don’t sugarcoat shit so pretty much and sometimes leave those two words out right and sometimes it backfires and sometimes it’s really good and in the moment might not feel good and and so that being said, I’m hoping that you know me and you and now us three I have a community that maybe they can keep you out of that burnout that was a long way to get to one freakin set you should have just just said this Yeah, thank you Love it. Love it a podcast I listened to he’s in this phrase now and it’s not his he’s like give me the baby skip the labor. Yeah, that was a lot of labor to get to the baby.

Well and Ben I kind of get it like whichever that third one was with that grown up word self self efficacy efficacy I can say that sounds like a swear word it does like cuz ministry and COVID no one had ever told us how to do it like Cornerstone failed failed me with that grant and they’re not supposed to know how to do that but like we were all trying to figure it out no pastor knew what to do even the ones who were experts were just making shit up. Yeah, and so I can see that because again it was you know, day after day I’m not sure how to do this what I’m supposed to do and that can lead towards that like I don’t know if I can continue on

well changed like every day for a while there get an order from the state and then the next day come to your staff and you’re like oh, by the way what we said yesterday, completely reverse it.

I think on Thursday before we shut everything down we were like hey, we’re still gonna have it everything’s good and then that Friday we canceled everything so we were like to our staff meeting and then another two hour staff meeting because we’re like hey, it looks good. And then one day later is like we’re gonna shut this whole thing down crazy It was crazy. Yeah.

So as far as burnout for you what you can you reiterate with then purse on a personal level?

Yeah, um, I think working out has definitely helped the burnout go away. Yeah, because I think it gives me something that I am able to control who Yeah, right like who control Yeah, well in COVID you can’t control anything and especially when the job’s changing families changing everything’s changing. Then then working out having accountability and just getting it done you can control it and that’s you know, moments where you can just work out the crap that’s going on so

yeah, I look at burnout is is like doing hobbies that’s what I get burned out in. You know, I had bees for a while for like, four Five years, it

was so weird to hear on the podcast because you never talk about it anymore ever. And like I had no idea. I was like what the world?

Like I’m passionate about it. Like if someone starts talking to me about honey bees, I can rattle some stuff, some cool facts, just to make me look good. You know what I mean? Whatever. But, but I don’t really experience burnout with like, my job or anything like that. I don’t know, I just didn’t feel a lot during COVID. I mean, I know we’re kind of talking about burnout around COVID. But I didn’t really feel any of that. So I guess that’s good. I mean,

you may ever feel burned out on your job. Like, I don’t know. Not really,

I don’t know, when it probably helps that it’s, like, more seasonal.

Yeah, that’s true. I mean, I guess when I get towards the end of season, I’m chomping at the bit to get out. Riley. Come on. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, after you know, spreading fertilizer on, like, 10 10 million square feet. You know, for the season, though, you know, you’re you’re kind of done with it. But, but as far as referencing to COVID I didn’t I bet I was more snarky and more assholey in general, for sure. But I don’t feel I look at it as like burnout. So that’s kind of where I’m at. Yeah, but

why does it seem to be those under 45? Are those who burnout? like, Ooh, that’s a good, like, and I’m calling myself out at age 37. I think I actually told people the other day, I was 38. What happened? Well, I mean,

for the last four months, I’ve told people I’m 46. And I did the math and I’m not Yeah,

but so that’s a question How come it seems to be those of us under 45? Who will burn out in take the self care?

Because I think the older generation doesn’t talk about it. Okay? And doesn’t do it. Like my mother in law. She’s not gonna listen to this. She won’t go to therapy she won’t do all those things. And she’s I love her and and and I guess if she did listen, this is I’m not she’s broken. She had a shitty life. She had a shitty childhood terrible. I don’t know if there was abuse, but there was a lot of neglect and involved in that. But she needs help. And she didn’t you know, my my father in law matter and took care of her and married her and then my father in law died and she doesn’t know how to do life without her husband and stuff like that. So I think this that generation, like I, you know, she’ll do everything else to to do things but won’t go to therapy, which frustrates me. So my point saying that younger people, I think we’re starting to realize that it’s okay. And I consider myself young, a little you looking at me, that I think that’s what it is. I mean, do you agree? I think a lot of people would say that they’re a bunch of wimps.

Yeah. And which I hate. I know. But that’s kind of what runs through my head. Sometimes with burnout is like, why is it happening to those of us under 45? Or are we the only ones just open and honest about exactly, that’s really what

it is? I think.

I mean, it’s, I think it’s a thing everyone has, yeah, there’s no way they cannot have it. Yeah.

So what’s playing through my mind is this. I’m not even sure how to put it all into words. So I’m gonna try bear with me. But have you ever met somebody our age who is just like, ultra cynical, like, people know them as the person that is just like, stay away from them? They’re just such a jerk. They’re just such a jaded, whatever. When you hear those words, typically what comes to mind is somebody of the older generation, I don’t like curmudgeon II like yeah, I don’t hear that. Describe describing younger people. So to answer your question, Mike, I think a lot of people older people are burned out, but it’s showing in that curmudgeon, like

they just don’t know how to handle it.

And so they don’t know how to handle it. So they handle it by being an asshole, basically. Yeah. And so their burnout is not acknowledged, but it’s impacting how they show up in the world. Now, this is painting with broad strokes. But when I look at our generation and younger, I don’t often look at them and say, why didn’t asshole like he’s just so ridiculous.

Other than me on Friday night, I was I wasn’t gonna

say, yeah, you were. Do you say, Man, I bet he’s broken. Do You Do Is that what you say? instead of like, when they’re young Do you do I tried to fight if I come across somebody like that, maybe so you’re saying you don’t come across?

Not not among younger people, like the people who are usually jaded and cynical are older people. I don’t see that. And so what I’m getting at is, perhaps older people do experience burnout and the way they experience it causes them to be closed minded, jaded, cynical, because they’ve never dealt with the things that are causing them to be that way.

Well, you know, as you say, that I can see I can see that now in those of us who are who are our age haven’t dealt with this stuff. They’re starting to become more of the cynic. Yeah, they’re really coming that cynic well on Facebook like what do you what do you like 50 years old they’re starting to complain like 50 year olds on Facebook. You say that like that’s okay. No, that makes sense. They’re not dealing with it. They’re not. And that’s where they’re gonna go unless they deal with the shit inside. Yeah, okay. Make sense?

What do you do if you’re feeling burned out? What if you’re feeling exhausted or cynical or you’re just lacking self efficacy? As I wrap up this topic of burnout, the life hacker article that I referenced has these suggestions if you’re dealing with exhaustion due to burnout, rest, take time off, find a way to reduce your obligations, family or otherwise, or any other strategy that will result in getting more rest. If you’re being super cynical, what can you do? Well find a way to connect with people in a meaningful way. That’s what I do. Yeah, but I mean,

if you’re already cynical for it’s, it’s like, okay, just go fix yourself. You know what I mean? Like if you’re being cynical, be like, Okay, I’m not gonna be like, it’s not that easy.

No, that’s what I’m saying. Surround yourself with people who are positive. Yeah, but even That’s hard. Well, is it is Rico is recovery ever easy?

No, but my point is is like the life hacker saying just just do this. You know what I mean? I guess I’m mocking the article. Yeah. It’s like, sure. Yeah. My my wife. Like if I’m doing something that’s an issue. I be like, Okay, let me just flip a switch. Like that was early on our marriage. I don’t say that anymore. No, but I mean, that’s what it was like it. It takes a lot of work to get it back. Well, okay.

Well, if that’s too much work well. What about just doing a random small act of kindness to somebody that’ll help you

but if you’re already cynical, how do you even get to that point?

Just do it. I mean, at some point you just have to do it. How did I get from the point of sitting on my ass doing nothing to going to the gym yet? just

did it? No, he did it because there were a lot of baby steps that worked up to that.

What if the baby step is just going? Good? b What if a baby step is just giving $5 to a pain handler I don’t I wouldn’t suggest that but

I just know that when I’m it’s it’s like even for me in perspective, if I’m in a terrible mood, it doesn’t just go like I’m going to surround myself by kindness with guiding people like I’m moving my arm like a like a Like what? What am I trying to think the Wizard of Oz? What are those Munchkins like? Wow, no, I

just feel like I just want to caution people. It’s not easy. It’s not easy to do that. And that’s okay. Yeah, but sometimes we just have to do the opposite. Yeah. And that’s what gets it started out

to do something to get the ball rolling right after that.

Exactly. And then if you’re feeling the reduced sense of efficacy it’s such a fun

word any dollar word band right?

$1 that I couldn’t say

no. $20 word just means like a really like high word. Okay, sorry.

So sometimes if it’s happening, the article talks about feeling it in the workplace if you’re feeling under challenged or feeling like you’re not a good fit, then really take stock in and see if that needs to be changed. What is the area that’s causing you to lack self confidence? Look at that and this is your right this article makes it sound so easy just go switch jobs

right? Well I mean they got to cut it they got to be brief anyways, right it’s a blog. Thank you guys so much for listening in threads podcast real quick. If you want to support the show, you can support us at buy me a slash threads podcast what’s buy me a coffee will buy me a coffee is a kind of like Patreon where you can subscribe to a monthly charge where we give you extra content and part of a membership group. You can also just buy us a random coffee of $5 coffee or $10 worth of coffees and that just goes help to help support the show the expenses and moving threads forward is what we want to do and it all takes money and so we would love your support and thank you to those who have already done it. We really, really appreciate it. Also, Ben’s gonna release the newsletter that this month and if you go to threads slash newsletter, put your email address in there. It will have just comings and goings of Ben what’s going on in our lives on top of the podcast and those kinds of things. We’d love your support and that too. So that’s the Reds podcast comm slash newsletter. Alright guys, thanks so much back to the show. So my current event is not a current event. It is faith based.

How long wow you’re pulling out the faith. Oh, by the way, I

went to church today so you can all stop judging me But anyways, this isn’t really about going to church. It’s actually a tic tac. Okay? And it’s a little song. Oh, so I’ll play it

234 you say that you’re a Christian but you hate on people who live out their lives a different way than how you say you do. The irony is perfectly because Jesus was a Jew and he be mad at you. You hate the LGBTQIA you say they’re wrong the indigenous and immigrants and blacks they don’t belong. A woman’s choice to use her voice and write a little song your hate list is too long. Why you call yourself a Christian? I don’t think that you’re a Christian. If you really were a Christian, you be a dick. Last you. Two Three. Nice,

so Oh, man, I struggle so much. That was when I saw that I was just like, this is perfect because I struggle so much with the hypocrisy in the Christian church. By the way, the LBGT q i am i’m not sure what the I is I try to be involved in that kind of thing and support it but as last month was, you know, Pride Month, but I just really hate the hypocrisy in the Christian church. And that was such a great video to kind of bring that your sexual asexual. Okay, thank you. Did it just pop into your head did nice. I was trying to like blurted it right out so I knew it was

honestly the competition, the competitiveness and we saw Mike looking it up and I’m like, I gotta get there first.

Man. You Doug way back in the brain ninja. He’s

a ninja ninja. Yeah, so

it just really bothers me. With I grew up with hypocritical parents, basically. I mean, how do you go to church but beat your kid? Or how do you go to church and neglect your child or not spend time with them and those kinds of things. So I don’t have a ton to say about it. But I was hoping that would bring discussion a lot from YouTube being you know, you’re not in ministry right now. But Ben had some Ben deep breath had one beer guys one frickin beer. And it’s like a 4.5 it’s super, like, just being ordained and being in the ministry and going to school for it, and having the church issues that you had with some people. And then I don’t know your church history much, Mike. I mean, obviously you’re you’re working it right now. But I just want to explore what you think about the hypocrisy and especially related to the whole political Trump thing how all these trumpers think they’re Christian, but this guy’s you know, we don’t Yeah, on to that, but what do you say, Ben?

What always gets me like I am fully on board with the the comments about the politics and the, I mean, you can listen back to all kinds of episodes where I talk about Jesus and the flag and the country and faith and all of that. So I am jiving with the song up until they bring up the LGBTQ. And I get I feel like I’m still I don’t know, some days I’m on the fence of it’s totally okay. Like, or that wouldn’t be on the fence. I feel like I’m so close to the fence either. One day, I’m feeling one day you went through the gate? Yeah, one day I’m feeling the pole of Yeah, it’s totally okay. Like, Jesus would be cool with this. It doesn’t Bible doesn’t really specifically call this out. And then then there’s the other side of the fence, which is where a lot of my, my church and Christian people are. And that’s opposite its homosexuality is a sin, we should be calling it out instead of accepting it and celebrating it. And so I have the poll of both sides. And I feel like I’m very much on the fence, like, some days I’ll be leaning more to the left and some days more to the right. And I feel like I’m in this constant tug of war with that issue. And I feel like the last couple of years really since threads. I’ve had opportunities to really not just talk to people, but get to know people. Yeah, who are who identify as LGBTQ. And some of the people love Jesus. And I’m just like, how can I,

like, judge them? look them in the eye when they’re like, I know, man,

it’s so hard and so I feel like It’s important to call out sin. And it’s important to you know, that take a stand on issues that are important. But what I go back to, and I’m sure Pastor Mike over here will have something to say about this. Jesus doesn’t ever talk about homosexuality, right? And so it’s like, if it was so Gosh, darn important,

the 10 commandment,

seriously something or Jesus would have talked about it in the New Testament, he says, at least not least over it, like orally, I mean, just mention it, like something. And then one of my friends that I went to college with, who has definitely gone to the side of, it’s okay to be gay. I mean, that’s a really poor way to sum it up. But he’s done a lot of study into the tax that talk about homosexuality. And very often those texts are not about, you know, consenting adults having sexual relations that are of the same gender. What’s being talked about is basically slave boys being owned by older men who are using them as sex toys. And of course, that is not okay. pedophilia in any culture anytime that’s not okay. So yeah, I could go on and on. So I’ll just sum it up by saying, I’m on the fence. And I’m okay with being on the fence right now. And I think

that’s okay, too. In reference to the song though I, they don’t clarify. But are they talking about the persecution of LGBTQ it’s not like, you’re saying it’s wrong or right or, you know, being mean? Or, or critical? I mean, you would never get on board with that.

No, you would, at the end of the day. Just love people. Love people. Like why does it matter if they’re a different sexuality? Like, and I was thinking about this, too, if people are LGBTQIA, and they’re in my church, awesome. Why can’t they just be there?

Well, it’s not your it’s not your you don’t judge. That’s not your deal. Like, but in the same breath, you coming to me and asking me to go to church kind of falls into the same way? Shouldn’t you go to them and say, hey, you’re being mean, not going to church? I mean, I guess it’s a sin. Maybe not. No, I don’t think so. I mean, it’s kind of okay, maybe it’s not apples to apples, but it’s apples still, to some sort of other fruit. Apple that it’s not going to be Apple, the vegetable. It’s not gonna be fruit, vegetable. But my point is, is like, Don’t you feel a calling to go to that person and say, you know, I love you, but this is not okay. I

don’t. Yeah, I really, and that’s, again, I think it’s a symptom of being on the fence. I don’t feel like it is my duty to go to a person of faith, who’s gay and say, You can’t be gay anymore. Well, it’s not

your duty, but they probably have a better chance of going to hell than me, right?

No, I don’t think so. Does your sexuality determine your salvation? It doesn’t.

This I think is the problem with Christians right now. We are not known by our love. We are known by our by our hate.

Yes. And that’s, that’s terrible. Totally.

I mean, because because Jesus said to people, Jesus loved people well, and he did Tom to go on going on sin to stop sending like, stop sending. But I don’t think he was like, just went up and was like, stop sinning. He went he had dinner, he hung out with him. He was Yeah, he was he was accused of being a drunkard and a glutton and all these things because he was loving people so well. I just love people well, I mean

I don’t know if you guys have any other thoughts about that it’s just I I’m just tired of the hate that I see from Christians or non Christians to be honest with you. I mean, let’s let’s generalize but I just you know, I I love everyone and that’s a big change for me too. I mean, you know me 20 years ago like people that know me now that if I you know, they’d be like, Who are you? Yeah, I mean, I was super right wing not right wing like crazy right? When I say right, yeah, everyone was different 20 years ago, right? Exactly. Exactly. I was right wing 20 years ago when it wasn’t labeled as an extremist. Yeah, exactly. And so I’ve changed a lot of my tunes a lot of stuff and and I feel better for it I just feel like a better person yeah being that way

do you think part of the problem is like you talking about hateful everybody? Like we don’t know how to disagree well, but but like, do you to like listen to stuff that like you did, like totally or like, I did not agree at all just to listen.


I have occasion. I mean, I like to argue.

Yeah. Like, just listen to listen and learn from a totally different view.

Yeah, I will do that. Okay. I want my views to be challenged because I might like, you know what, I might not be right. I So most

people I would say don’t listen read anything from someone that doesn’t go in there oh yeah and I think that and so I actually try to read a book from from atheists every every like quarter you know every few months try to read a book from an atheist yeah just to know because I’m like I don’t know everything yet or you know videos I try to listen to videos that are like that sometimes like oh man that hurts

I don’t seek it out but I when I listen to Rogan a lot and I don’t even Mark because I’m pissy went to Spotify and I hate the I love Spotify music but the platform of pod it’s all clunky like To me it’s not streamlined and so I stopped listening when he went to Spotify but he would always bring up stuff for me that I was like I didn’t agree with but like you know what? There’s some there’s some merit to whatever that is whether he had an atheist on or I mean he would have anyone yeah Christian atheist it didn’t matter yeah and so yeah, I didn’t but I don’t do what you do like I don’t go grab okay some literature that that will like be a totally against my view like

okay, I do seek out things that make me uncomfortable and we should be helpful we

should all like do a little like thing like that. I don’t read

we should go to each other’s churches.

I thought you know what, I have to bring this up I thought about your church today when I was in church I swear to god but we should like if you find something that you know would challenge me as long as it’s like a book on tape that I can listen to Yeah. Or reading or podcasts or yeah anything audio I love to but one more thing before we go on to Mike but we talked about you talked about the right and the left leaning mag and actually I brought that up today it’s so funny because we talked about alive and how empty it was in there and half our congregation okay this could be an exaggeration I’m getting this from the lead production guy went to chapel point because they didn’t wear any masks Yeah, and I was like, I don’t know I don’t like that and she’s like well why I don’t want those people in my church I go Yeah, but I don’t want to completely left leaning church. I want a mixed bag in my church. Yeah, I want leaders that have the stuff that conservative stuff and liberal stuff I want them together to work I don’t want left or just right and so it just it was funny that it came up and then as I was in church today, I was like, man, I wonder what we should go to Penn’s church like I seriously did I was

inviting you so we don’t have to.

I thought of Ben’s church today too because our servers were like an hour and a half Oh cheese oh well because again they’re like things that happen and then somebody was was preaching in Spanish and his wife was translating. So into a 20 minute sermon already. I know but I was thinking a bird’s eye view like this is right up Ben’s churches alley like go an hour and a half and have somebody preach in Spanish anyways

yeah, but that being said it was interesting that that got brought up because I don’t want Why did you get excited about the chapel point thing Have you heard about that?

Because my parents church lost there in the air and they sang half their people to chapel point. from Holland

Oh no, no, they’re from GR

well there’s more of them they’re more from hudsonville Oh

okay. I

saw that yeah they’re out they’re out there churches out in Jamestown area Can

you name what what church are they at?

I won’t I won’t name that But anyways,

they lost half of there’s a harbor point or no harbor house

no harbor probably I

know which one it is but I’m not gonna see it either.

But anyways, that sucks by the way it does totally like and I actually gave those people the benefit of doubt because I was like, when did they move because like there’s times where I our church I thought needed to ask and get off the pot like it’s time to move on. And they went too long is that when that person went to chapel one or the second the the mandate went into effect. They’re like, I’m out. Oh, yeah. I don’t want those people either. Yeah, I mean, if you hear this, I don’t like you. Just follow the rules. Okay, it’s pandemic for God’s sakes. All right, Mike.

So mine also is from the great state of Oregon. Thank you for pronouncing Can you tell us which one it is?

It’s Oregon it’s Oregon but I always say Oregon I feel like such an idiot because there’s

no it has to do with that in hunting. There is a ballot thing that they’re trying to get on the ballot to ban hunting and agriculture like killing of like cows and livestock but they can still sell meat yes stores that this is what the ballot is so

Oh, this is the stupidest thing already.

I’m so lost so

so as a hunter like again, I kind of it comes up to me I’m like so we kind of have guns like what about guns? What about hunting? What about that is people so that’s that’s why it stuck out to me. And it stuck out to me as a tough conversation because I think guns and hunting can be a tough conversations because you can ethics and take an animal’s life all that fun stuff. So I want to know what you guys think of this banning of hunting and killing livestock. I

need some more clarification is this in the state of Oregon? Yeah, the

whole state, a hole in higher state which half of the state right is farming?

Oh, more than half probably not probably not cattle. It’s probably more

outside of Portland, and Eugene. Okay, so there’s the interstate five runs on the westernmost part of Oregon. And on I five you go. You’ve got Eugene, which is very liberal University of Oregon is their head a little bit north here in Corvallis. That’s where the Oregon State University is, had a little bit north here in Salem. That’s where the capital is a lot of liberal people there. And then you had as far north as you can, and you’re in Portland, which we all know is a very liberal shit show.

Wow. They are a Portland audience. Sorry, is limited.

I’m going to see you in next week. I love you, but it’s true. But if you were to take that I five corridor out and it’s a small sliver of the state. If you were to take that out, you would be left with farming, agriculture, cattle, sheep, llamas, I mean, all kinds of stuff in the sticks of Oregon. Outside of that, that sliver of Oregon, it’s very West Michigan, like Oh, and I was on the very West End of the Eugene and on that line where it went from liberal Eugene to conservative outside, it’s just crazy to me that in that sliver is the majority of the population of Oregon. And so it’s so populated because of the universities because of Portland and the Capitol. But outside of that, are these people who feel like they have no representation and so what happens is you get these crazy propositions to ban hunting agriculture the rest of the state is I’m sure banging their head on the wall like what the hell is going on here

so it’s possible that that Western corridor couldn’t make that happen right

the majority of the people right I can make it happen and where they absolutely can by the way our last breakdown of stats only six listens in Oregon which is ridiculous because you have people out there I know we actually our highest is California then Michigan then Ohio Ohio I don’t know anyone in Ohio

very strange but I mean like I’m surprised that somewhere like California that’s the first one to do this but so hunting should hunting like Should we keep doing it and guns let’s let’s talk about oh

my god. So I will go first hunting First of all, if you stop killing them, you will kill your car will kill so much. Yeah, you’ll have an accident every 10 minutes. Yeah, car deer, the hunting involved is is is good for the environment. There’s a reason that you do that. Yes, abuse of it, of course. And that’s why they had the DNR and Michigan DNR, they they monitor all that stuff. I mean, they’re not stupid. You know what I mean? You have to have hunting, if you don’t have hunting, your car insurance will be $1,000 a month. But as far as like not killing livestock to eat, but yet you’re gonna be able to still get it from the grocery store. That’s like hypocrisy, right?

Which also means that they’re just gonna ship it in from a different state California or Washington.

Yeah, that’s the dumbest thing like how how what’s the validity of this this bill? I mean, is it like, Is this some dumb dumb ass representative? That’s what

was their name on it? No. So it looks like it’s gonna be a ballot it looks like approved to go on the ballot so people have to vote on it looks. It looks like they’ve gotten enough to then go around and get enough enough people to sign it to get it. So it’s not quite they’re not quite but but the first step of getting the 1000 signatures and then getting it to where they can.

Well, this is where you need to test before you can vote right now. me because easy. If you think about all the young people in those areas, of course they’re going to be like, Oh, yeah, I love the animals, blah, blah, blah. But I mean, how can you not how can you you’re a hypocrite. If you get the meat. You should be a vegetarian that Yeah,

except Mostar, though. Wow. I mean, in that quarter, I would guess that over half, and I’m okay with that. I know. I

would say yeah, I don’t know if it’s half but if they’re not vegan or vegetarian, they are very aware. And what comes to mind is a clip of portlandia which if you haven’t watched the show, go, oh my gosh, you just it’s hilarious. dabbas we don’t watch TV. Right? So funny. But one of the scenes is like, this couple is at a restaurant and they’re asking the waitress about server.

Talk about me. You call me a caveman? Yeah. He says waitress I’m talking about 50s.

Okay staff, the waitstaff. The server The the couple is asking them all about how is this animal treated on the farm and it’s just this whole it just devolves from there but that’s very much how it is like people want to know is this a cage free animal

so honestly if if I could find all that out I would focus on eating an animal that was like that I would pay more money I mean within reason I mean if it’s going to be $100 a pound I’m sorry I can’t afford that. Yeah, but I mean if I have to pay two or $3 more per pound that I know that the cow that I got it from was treated in killed humanely. Yeah, I’m 100% on board I love animals

Oh for sure. I don’t want to digress too much but when I lived in Oregon I was the healthiest way that I’ve ever been as an adult move back to Michigan well

you better move back then

yeah no right he’s gonna go out there move out there

oh can you imagine if he got the bug back he’s like guys hey, I gotta really need to go back I got it we got to talk

so you know what’s funny though cuz you’re talking about it this came to mind you know so people are worried about their cow and how it is a deer is really happy and tell the point you shoot it like it like it really is just going through the woods it’s no right life and so like it’s so but but they’re gonna cause more cows to get killed because what are the families out there going to eat if they’re not eating deer like assuming there’s families getting three four deer like just like here? Yeah, so they’re gonna eat a cow or two more Yeah,


yeah that’s a good point from like a feedlot

I mean they’re both ludicrous but to not get to not kill your I mean so that does that mean chickens too? Yeah, yeah.

Chickens goats whatever else animal you want to eat pigs

animal cruelty to kill them next they’re gonna ban plants because it’s inhumane to pull a plant I mean

this is where I’d be like go to a pastor and be like so I mean God put these on I mean what is their purpose? Well they put it on the planet for us to eat

in Genesis God gave them in basically put man over them and ever since the dawn of time we’ve hunted yeah so

I guess I mean a lot of people

yeah, there’s no matter what the Bible says no, because I mean without it just it hit me as because not only because of their because whatever they do whatever they want, but I wonder if this takes hold if more we’ll see more liberal states go this way. And here’s the thing like I’m pretty moderate, but like on guns, I’m actually conservative and liberal. So like, I can get you on vote. What

do you mean?

So I love hunting. I love owning the guns I do. But I also think it should be way harder to buy guns than it is what kind of guns any gun should be way harder to buy. Even even even my rifle my rifle was too easy to buy. I ended up going to a big store in the area called Cabela’s. And I went there they end up doing a background check. I didn’t get an air quotes. It took like 20 seconds. Yeah, cuz if it doesn’t ding back okay, but a normal background check for like what we do at church takes days because there’s different databases, there’s no way in 20 seconds there, dinging every database. Like for me, I would much rather go into Cabela’s have to wait a day to make sure they did a fullback right. Yeah,

yeah. Yeah, I

mean, I kind of agree with you because I mean, I I lean pretty far to the right with firearms. I’m for all that, and I’m sickened about all the shootings. But most of those shootings those guns were obtained easily. It’s true. So making me wait three days for a rifle. The guy that’s going to go to shoot up a school isn’t going to do that. Yeah, you’re basically slowing the people that are legally wanting to buy the firearm, but I get what you’re saying what can be done to slow that down

and this is from me who owns two guns and I’d be fine with owning more but like it shouldn’t be as easy it is to get because it’s not easy to go get a car right i’d do more work or a car it’s true. Well that’s

the problem because of the the Second Amendment. It’s an amendment so it’s like oh my god, but it doesn’t mean that it can’t be so a little more. I assume you’re not into constitutional carry then right? Basically, you don’t have to get a background check. Now I’m not into that. So yeah, that’s a little crazy for me.

I don’t I mean, again, him personally, I don’t believe that I that I’m able to take someone’s life. Yeah, but again, I I’m pro gun rights. I think people do have the right to carry but I just I was amazed the last time I got how easy it was. I was like, I should not have been able to walk in. It took two hours because I was like, should I get this caliber this caliber? Yeah, that took most of the time. It shouldn’t have been that easy to get a gun. I agree. Sure.

Yeah. But I shot your thing down by saying the people that kill people use illegal guns, some

of them but i would i would actually say Do you have any stats on that? Or is that like the common and I would

say that’s common, but I think there are ones that like they did go get it. Right. Like you said, like went to Cabela’s. Got it? Yeah, there are those out there. 100% I mean, you You

know, or or those with mental health, where they’re struggling. I mean, think about how much 24 hours can do if you’re down and depressed. Oh, yeah, that 24 hours can be a lifesaver.

Yeah, that’s a good point. I agree with you on that, that that would be that I would be on board with that reason, saying, hey, it takes three days for you to get a rifle. Yeah, that I would agree with you on that for that reason.

Yeah, but now for a number of reasons. I am not a gun owner. I haven’t met from

Oregon man. Oh, I

took you out. We did some skeet and trap shooting, you would die. I’m sure you’d be like, this is the funnest thing. Oh, let’s

Okay, that’s definitely something we have to do. Okay. Yes, I made it. I have.

I have like those guns in my safe right now.

Do you have a thrower? No, I

go to a course.

I have a thrower my parents have acres. So for Oregon go to the course. I mean, it costs an arm and a leg. But okay,

I have no issue with people owning guns, I know, you know, people should have the right to own them. But in my life. A, I’ve battled some pretty deep depression in my life. Be I am impulsive as what both of these guys can attach to that. I don’t think things through all the way I just jump in and figure it out. Yeah, you shouldn’t own a gun for my own safety. And for the safety of those around me. I don’t own a gun. Because who’s to say, God forbid I’m having the worst day and it just feels all consuming. If I had a gun readily available to me, I don’t trust myself to push past that, you know

what, if you went out and shot and learned about guns, you would change your tune, I would realize how powerful they are. And you still might have the draw to it. But you know, it once you have the respect for it, I mean, you got to be pretty down in the dumps, like,

and I am just I have been and so because I know myself, it’s just something that I I am fine with firing a gun, I am fine with going to a range and having a day of it. Right. But for me because of just who I am and the struggles I’ve had, it’s just a boundary that I’ve said I’m not going to be a gun owner. And if you’re listening and you want to break into my house, good luck because I have a security system and you know,

well I seriously half the people that have guns in their house if they break in they’re gonna shoot themselves. I mean you, you have to, you have to have some knowledge without and honestly the best self defense is a self defense shotgun, not a handgun. That was handguns. You did something to spray and pray like one bullet, you’re going to miss them you’re going to be your adrenaline’s going to be high. You just need a shotgun that just goes kablammo and just goes and spreads it out and spreads it out. Because is the thing

with with you know, I always shot rifle and then I shot a handgun. And like from like, 15 feet away, it’s hard to hit any dude,

it takes a lot of practice, like at home. Yeah, being there at arraign. Yeah, tried drawing it from a holster. And that’s why you know, like when you see cops and when that stuff happens when they when they are able to stop the threat. It’s amazing. That takes a lot of practice. But you know, we digress. Big time.

That’s all right.

So where we go from here, Ben?

Well, I thought we could wrap things up by just sharing a takeaway, what’s something that stood out to you about the conversation that we’ve had about the three issues? Maybe something that you learned that was surprising about one of us? Maybe you felt challenged? Or you felt surprised? I’ll go first so you to have some time to think because I’m seeing some looks in the room. But just that aha moment of Ben’s church, like, I guess one thing that I was surprised by was the fact that we all three, were thinking the same. That’s so weird. Like, I would love it if you guys came into my church, because I love my church today. I didn’t know this, but we have homeless people that go to our church, like I guess maybe I should have known given our location, but we had a homeless panel. And I’m thinking, I can’t ever remember a time where part of my congregation was homeless people that were willing to go in front of the church and say, This is what life is like for me. And this is what’s hard about being homeless. And this is how I’ve experienced God on the streets. And this is what home means to me. It was like, I’m sitting there like, this is church. This is incredible. So just another moment of Wow. And then just the worship at my church, like it’s gospel choir meets, like praise band, and it’s just, I don’t know, it’s so novel. So the thought that both of you guys had were thinking of my church is just like,

yeah, I mean, I don’t know why I was thinking of it. Like, I don’t know. Cuz that would put me out of my comfort zone oh

my gosh that’s why I want you to go oh my gosh

I think maybe you should go just because it’d be so out of your comfort zone

I mean I think it’d be good for me but I actually more looking at I’m thinking about my kids because like over the holiday weekend they spent time up there that the cabin and they were just they were so whiny as some stuff and it just pissed me off how spoiled my freakin kids are like I don’t want to bring that church just to like see this but I want to be like this is this is a little different like this is somewhat different than what life you have. You know what I mean? Like Like if they would have came today with that homeless panel they ever been like, with their mouth wide open? Yeah, and that would have been a good reflection for for me too. Because my kids got way too damn easy. Yeah, pisses me off Yeah. Bam

the cause of bed when you’re talking about that it just reminded me when I first started learning to preach it was it was a it was an urban church and people would come in off the streets drunk as you’re trying to preach they’d sit up there and just start like drunk talking not

I would not like that crazy me that you crossed the line there if you’re intoxicated I would want them thrown out I’m sorry

you know there are people that have come to Jesus high on like Alice D So

yeah, but they come in there because they’re cold and they want a meal and so they’re just being well there

wasn’t meal there was just coffee but anyways I just I just reminded me of that here’s here’s my takeaway is that Jason likes faith talk it’s yeah surprises me because like I like purposely picked one that wasn’t faith because I’m like every time I’ve come on we’ve talked faster my I know I’d so I want to talk about guns dead gun totally I was pretty surprised

about that to be honest. I know the takeaway for me I didn’t know you were a gun guy to be honest with

you. I know like I’m wearing like non like Hicks stuff but I also grew up in the country Yeah. Anyway so like I was surprised you brought up faith talk and I think you know your rest I

brought I brought up faith talk but it wasn’t the positive part of faith it was the negative and that’s the problem I’m always in the negative and what a cynic cynicism is right what an impactful message today I was a little tuned out but it really hit Megan hard and it was about relationships and with Jesus and like she needs to circle back with me with it. Okay, like so. Yeah, and it was it was kind of hard for me to church I’ll be honest with you. I went to smoke some cannabis for I went because I was really anxious and my pen was dead. Oh, and I was really bummed about that because I had a lot of anxiousness going to church and I put up some walls with my wife and that I have to circle back on but I don’t know what it is like it really actually pisses me off that this is happening I’ll be honest with you as much as I put up a wall and kind of a D bag about it sometimes I I’m pissed I’m pissed on this struggle so I don’t know that’s that’s about it for me as far as the takeaway I really enjoyed it my takeaway actually I wrote a note down is I really enjoyed the banter before we got into the topic I really had a good time we were laughing even though we were talking about whoop shit It was really fun I circled back we circle back I really think that I could enjoy a podcast with all of us just

one that’s just I think that’s real life right? We all have we all have drama that comes up in friendships and yes because we’re humans we want to be the best

and I think people like to listen to that that dirty a little yeah so yeah, guys thank you so much for listening with reds podcast real appreciate We hope you enjoyed this episode we hope it stirred some emotion in you if it did please email us Hello at threads podcast all that fun, calm that kind of stuff. Who doesn’t remember that that what do we got net dot biz other Gosh. And coming up next week, it’ll be the mental health format. We’re going to talk about just different aspects of mental health and how our mental health is going and all that fun stuff. So once again, guys, thank you so much for listening preds podcast. We’ll see in a week.

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